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Author Topic: cam tensioners  (Read 2489 times)

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todd444

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cam tensioners
« on: July 14, 2011, 04:37:41 PM »

here are a couple of pics of my tensioners at 47,167 miles
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todd444

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2011, 05:16:03 PM »

not bad for 47k my mechanic says the new hydrolic tensioners wear just as fast
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HILLSIDECYCLE.COM

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #2 on: July 15, 2011, 07:18:38 AM »

That is what they look like, at that mileage, usually.
Actually, have witnessed those like that as early as 2000 miles, and not much worse that that at 130,000 plus.
Scott
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grc

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #3 on: July 15, 2011, 08:36:44 AM »

That is what they look like, at that mileage, usually.
Actually, have witnessed those like that as early as 2000 miles, and not much worse that that at 130,000 plus.
Scott


Unfortunately that's the problem in a nutshell, the huge variability of the entire system.  Some die a sudden death at 10-20k, others seem to last forever.  Those folks who assume they have the good ones and thus don't inspect them on a regular basis risk major failures, and Harley couldn't care less. 

To me the really sad and frustrating part is that I have never had to inspect or worry about the chain tensioner's in the other bikes or various automotive engines I've had over the years, and I've never had any type of failure.  In other words, other folks seem to know how to do this stuff and make the parts reliable and consistent.  Why is it that Harley can't do the same?  It's not like they are selling a cheap cut rate product; they charge a pretty hefty price for the less than mediocre crap they pawn off.


Jerry
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tazmun

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2011, 10:22:05 AM »

Jerry, your so right! Some last some don't. I live very close to the engine plant
and have a few HOG club members that work there. They alway say the company
wants to make parts FASTER & CHEAPER!!! It's seems to only pertain to the
"GOOD OLD BOTTOM LINE"!
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cahdbiker

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2011, 10:35:56 AM »

Todd444, I bet when HD tested the original cam chain tensioners they knew they were going to crap out anywhere from 20k to 40k miles, but they also knew that by that time the warranty probably would have run out so they figured "good enough". There are a lot of people who keep their bikes for 5-10 years and then I see them for sale in the local paper with less than 10 or 15 thousand miles on them. HD knows this is going to happen so the second owner gets stuck paying them to fix their inadequate product. I wish they would make the tensioners easy to inspect and change like the one in the primary case. By the way for those with a twin cam B motor their are also tensioners for the balancers. I haven't heard of anyone on the site saying they had a problem with those. However my friends did go out and destroy his engine, but he had 180,000 miles on it at the time. CAHDBIKER
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BillH

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #6 on: July 15, 2011, 11:47:18 PM »

Soooo...where did you find all the little orange chunks??? filter, oil pump, cam chest.  Was the motor still running at this point?
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todd444

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #7 on: July 17, 2011, 09:44:07 PM »

did not find any pieces everything seemed to be  working well just wamted to change them out
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Ironhorse

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #8 on: July 17, 2011, 10:24:42 PM »

Why doesn't HD use gear drive cams and do away with tensioners all together?
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sadunbar

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #9 on: July 17, 2011, 10:25:26 PM »

The EPA noise regulations... 
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BillH

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #10 on: July 17, 2011, 10:48:26 PM »

Why doesn't HD use gear drive cams and do away with tensioners all together?

Then they couldn't charge (rob) their customers $1500 to change them when the warranty runs out!!!

Bill
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Midnight Rider

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #11 on: July 18, 2011, 02:39:13 PM »

The EPA noise regulations... 

That, and the fact that then they'd have to put a crankshaft in the bike that ran true.
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grc

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #12 on: July 18, 2011, 04:02:34 PM »

In Harley's case, they changed to chains from the gear drives that were standard on their earlier engines because of several factors.  One of those was supposedly sound emissions, but the most important to Harley was related to cost.  Gear drives require tighter tolerances on all the various parts ($), require more precision in assembly ($), and have much less capability to tolerate failures of the first two requirements (more $ for warranty when they screw up).  So the simple answer is, $.

I find it to be very amusing and enlightening when I think about just how many other companies have used chains to drive everything from overhead cams to transaxles and transfer cases for decades, all without the widespread failures and drama of the Twin Cam Harley engines.  It still comes down to poor engineering and cheapskate management at H-D.  They have a real talent for taking technology that has worked very well elsewhere and somehow screwing it up.  And they don't seem to care a whole lot when they do screw the pooch.  No extended coverage was ever offered by the factory even when the failure rates became impossible to ignore (but they noticed the trend enough to come up with a kit to change the old system over to the new system on older bikes, and then promoted same through the dealers as a customer paid "upgrade").  


Jerry
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grandpadoc

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #13 on: July 18, 2011, 04:17:51 PM »

I remember how Harley was having so much trouble getting through the EPA noise requirements back in the 80's. They changed everything on the intake and exhaust side just to find the offending decibels were coming from the primary...go figure.  Doc
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sadunbar

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Re: cam tensioners
« Reply #14 on: July 18, 2011, 04:30:47 PM »

That, and the fact that then they'd have to put a crankshaft in the bike that ran true.

details, details....   ::)
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