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[Fired00d]

It would be a shame. Like you all I want to do is ride, but one can only take getting stepped on so many times before he decides enough is enough.

 [smiley=pumpkin.gif]
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 [smiley=fireman.gif]

[UltraPolecat]

Agreed D00d.  I am like a junkyard dog when cornered,

[smiley=sauer021.gif] [smiley=rifle.gif]

but at my advancing age I would rather just enjoy life.  I suspect we as a group are the wrong guys to mess with...

[Midnight Rider]

I really don't think the pre 07's are going to be an issue, at least not with reputable dealers.  But, it really sounds like they're getting serious about changes to the 07 models.  They're only offering the SE Pro pipes like I have on mine for one more year, and they will not put them on an 07 from what I've heard, even if somebody wanted to.  Honestly, I hope all the guys who are getting the 07's with the new pipes they have, new engine, etc are happy as pigs in the sunshine with the bikes, just as they come off the showroom floor....sound, performance, and paint.  And yes, some will have aftermarket mods done, and for those warranty issues which have nothing to do with those mods, they will have to fix 'em free.  But, I think if they have an issue related to those things I mentioned in the earlier post, there's going to be problems, not necessarily from the dealer, but when they submit the work for authorization/payment, there may be issues with the MOCO for sure.  The dealers are going to be caught between a rock and a hard place.

[Garznhogs]

Talking with my dealer this week: He said there were no demo rides at the intro show... he heard that there was a muffler issue. They did have 06 and 07 bikes to start and idle, but no rides. This week he rode a brand new 07 96" and said now he knows why... the mufflers have a hard to describe sound, sort of 'tinny' when cruising. He didn't like it and figured lots of folks will continue to change them out.  The parts manager said the new SERTS will have 07 on them.  Neither one had much info regarding mods to the SEs.  
Just like 'what will the new bikes be' question, there sure are a lot of different rumors flying!
(The parts manager also told me that the latest version of the SERT is the 'F'. I said my disc has 'G' on it and he didn't understand what I was talking about. So....) [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif]

Garz

[KentuckyHarleyDude]

I really don't think the pre 07's are going to be an issue, at least not with reputable dealers.  But, it really sounds like they're getting serious about changes to the 07 models.  They're only offering the SE Pro pipes like I have on mine for one more year, and they will not put them on an 07 from what I've heard, even if somebody wanted to.  Honestly, I hope all the guys who are getting the 07's with the new pipes they have, new engine, etc are happy as pigs in the sunshine with the bikes, just as they come off the showroom floor....sound, performance, and paint.  And yes, some will have aftermarket mods done, and for those warranty issues which have nothing to do with those mods, they will have to fix 'em free.  But, I think if they have an issue related to those things I mentioned in the earlier post, there's going to be problems, not necessarily from the dealer, but when they submit the work for authorization/payment, there may be issues with the MOCO for sure.  The dealers are going to be caught between a rock and a hard place.

Man all I can say is that at this point I feel better and better EVERY day about my 03 SERK ....

Bama

[Pap]

I've been to alot of HD dealerships in my years and can't recall one single one where employees and owners didn't ride bikes with most of them being relatively new models and with modified exhausts.   [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]  I suggest we watch what these owners and employees are doing to their own '07's as an indicator of how they'll react to the new EPA regs.

Ride Safe,
Pap

[Twolanerider]

I said my disc has 'G' on it and he didn't understand what I was talking about. So....) [smiley=huepfenjump3.gif]

Garz

There's a "G" disc buried under stuff here on my desk that I know is at least two months old.

[arcticdude]

I don't think I'd put too much stock in ANYBODY that states you can't even change exhaust on a Harley.  The moco themselves already have 110 kits for the 96 (okay, they're just the SE stuff packaged for the "everyday" rider) and there are SE slipon mufflers for the 07's already listed.  There's way too much $ in the aftermarket for the gov't to completely shut it down.  Think back to 1973-74.  Weren't the cars we were driving all big POS's and they didn't get too much better until the mid 80's.  Now there's horsepower wars going on.  Not just cars, but trucks too.  Personally, if somebody told me that you couldn't do anything to a Harley, I'd be looking to sell some swampland because I'd found a buyer.

[KentuckyHarleyDude]

I don't think I'd put too much stock in ANYBODY that states you can't even change exhaust on a Harley.  The moco themselves already have 110 kits for the 96 (okay, they're just the SE stuff packaged for the "everyday" rider) and there are SE slipon mufflers for the 07's already listed.  There's way too much $ in the aftermarket for the gov't to completely shut it down.  Think back to 1973-74.  Weren't the cars we were driving all big POS's and they didn't get too much better until the mid 80's.  Now there's horsepower wars going on.  Not just cars, but trucks too.  Personally, if somebody told me that you couldn't do anything to a Harley, I'd be looking to sell some swampland because I'd found a buyer.

Cat I guess only time will tell

Bama

[Ceej]

This is a whole new EPA deal - unrelated to any car rules. These rules came about as the result of a deal the EPA made to avoid getting sued for some failure to crackdown on dirt bikes I believe. When the enviromentalists threatened the case the made a deal to drop the suit in exchange for harsher rules in 2007 on ALL motorcycles that would prevent ANY modification to an EPA approved bike. This means ANY modification that would change the performance or work load on the bike - example - swap stock wheel and tire to a "fat" tire - adds work load to bike, violates EPA rules - Period. These rules would never fly with the public or automakers if implemented on cars, but then again they are way cleaner to begin with. Being honest - our bikes are old technology and something like 20 times more polluting than current cars, this is what the whole lawsuit was about 4 or 5 years ago and lead to this. They knew there wasn't enough power in the biker world to put up a fight and it was all tied in with rules on bikes, snowmobiles and ATV's on state and federal lands. Notice all the new "clean" snowmobiles out there today, same story.  In the trucking world we have a 2007 mandate coming down also, the new trucks are costing $10-15K more than last year due to the cleaner engines(and the run hotter, and get poorer fuel milage), and you diesel pick drivers will notice the fuel is changing this fall from low sulfur to ultra low sulfur - start adding a fuel treatment as the sulfur was a big lubricater for our injectors. Anyhow, the truckers have no voice like the bikers, so the government can pass the rules knowing the general public dont care. Anyone find a shop that will put straight pipes on your street car lately, not a chance. This is just a rule on one car part, the same thing now applies to any 07-later bike, and there will be enforcement at HD dealers as well as indy shops. It could go as far as the trucking world - any work done on my rig has paperwork filed showing the vehicles VIN number as well as the wrenches license # and shops license #. All recorded and filed. Makes me thinks HD has planned for this and pushed more and more shops into becoming the "Mall" style Gift shops they have become. More Chrome & Clothes - Less wrenching.

[ace4059]

I think you're right about most people at least doing an exhaust mod on their bike.  I'm thinking HD has done a lot of R&D on these new exhausts they're offering up this year to get some kind of compromise that people can live with, at least for the initial warranty period, then it'll be wide open again.  But for those who choose to get extended warranties, they've got problems.

Jerry....not to say that they will be able to void all aspects of the warranty, but they could really make it hard on a fella if ANYTHING happened to the motor which could remotely be related to a mod to the A/F mix, combustion process, etc.  Plus, if you tried to fight them on it, they could always call in the Feds and get you fined, which would probably cost more than the repair if you just paid for it.  Catch 22, anyone?  At any rate, it sounds like the dealers won't be tinkering with any of the '07's for anyone.  Right now, I'm glad I've got an '06 with the mods made by the dealer and an extended warranty they have to honor.  The next year will be an interesting one, it seems.   [smiley=nervous.gif]

 

I'M NOT SO SURE THEY HAVE TO HONOR THE WARRANTY ON YOUR '06. JUST LOOK AT THE PROBLEM "PORTHOLE" HAD WITH HIS WARRANTY BECAUSE HE HAD A SERT. I DONT THINK ANYONE IS SAFE NOW DAYS WHEN IT COMES TO MODS AND WARRANTY ISSUES. YOU HAVE TO DECIDE TO KEEP IT STOCK UNTIL YOUR WARRANTY EXPIRES OR SAY WHAT THE HECK, I'M GOING TO CHANCE IT AND GO W/ THE MODS AND IF SOMETHING HAPPENS AND THEY WON'T HONOR MY WARRANTY TO HECK W/ EM!

[Steve_G]

What did the evo engines do to the value of shovels?  What did the twin-cam do to the value of evos?  Personally I am not feeling good about buying an '06 USE for a premium price, then having the thing obsoleted.  There are quite a few people who have tossed their 5 speed tranny and spent big bucks to get a 6 speed.  There are also quite a few people who have changed cams to get increased reliability and more power.  Time will tell if the new cam drive system is "the ticket".  However, I think Harley must have spent some R&D time and money before switching to the new system.  Who would rather have a 103 than a 110 in. engine?  It's not just the increase in displacement, but a whole host of changes that I'm pretty sure will be for the better.  You can keep sinking money into trying to catch up to the new changes, but financially you're just digging a hole.  -That is unless you're so in love with your bike that you plan on keeping it forever.  That was my plan until I see what they have done with the new bikes.  Now I think I'll just sit back and see how the '07s work out in the next year.  If they are as good as I think they are, I'll probably trade for one in '08.  
  I do agree that the paint schemes are not as artful for the '07s.  I still think the small leather tour packs should be replaced with color matched king tour packs.  -After all, these are supposed to be their top of the line touring bikes.
  No doubt the changes with the new bikes will be another reason why the stealers will be offering you less on a trade in- saying "everybody wants the 6 speed and the bigger engine".  
  Oh well, everything goes to hell eventually, it's just a matter of time.  You can slow it's decent somewhat with chrome polish and 3M Imperial Handglaze along with microfiber cloths! [smiley=drink.gif] [smiley=drink.gif]   -Steve

[kng103]

What did the evo engines do to the value of shovels?  What did the twin-cam do to the value of evos?  Personally I am not feeling good about buying an '06 USE for a premium price, then having the thing obsoleted.  There are quite a few people who have tossed their 5 speed tranny and spent big bucks to get a 6 speed.  There are also quite a few people who have changed cams to get increased reliability and more power.  Time will tell if the new cam drive system is "the ticket".  However, I think Harley must have spent some R&D time and money before switching to the new system.  Who would rather have a 103 than a 110 in. engine?  It's not just the increase in displacement, but a whole host of changes that I'm pretty sure will be for the better.  You can keep sinking money into trying to catch up to the new changes, but financially you're just digging a hole.  -That is unless you're so in love with your bike that you plan on keeping it forever.  That was my plan until I see what they have done with the new bikes.  Now I think I'll just sit back and see how the '07s work out in the next year.  If they are as good as I think they are, I'll probably trade for one in '08.  
  I do agree that the paint schemes are not as artful for the '07s.  I still think the small leather tour packs should be replaced with color matched king tour packs.  -After all, these are supposed to be their top of the line touring bikes.
  No doubt the changes with the new bikes will be another reason why the stealers will be offering you less on a trade in- saying "everybody wants the 6 speed and the bigger engine".  
  Oh well, everything goes to hell eventually, it's just a matter of time.  You can slow it's decent somewhat with chrome polish and 3M Imperial Handglaze along with microfiber cloths! [smiley=drink.gif] [smiley=drink.gif]   -Steve
 

if its true what they are saying about mods to the 2007's
then i'll take a 103 any day of the week!!
i am sure that most of our 103's will smoke that 110"
i know mine will!!!!
and if and when i get tired of my 103 i'll do the jims 120"

[SPIDERMAN]

IMO The value of any Harley-Davidson motorcycle is relative to the performance, popularity and availability of the particular model in question. I don't believe that as new technology is introduced it adversely affects the value of the older bikes in and of itself. Obviously, and again IMO an 07 SEUC would be greatly desireable over an 06. That's because you've got an almost apples for apples situation in the two years with the 07 having the 110 and 6 speed as well as some other smalller differences. But the 110/6 speed equations would not affect a stock 06 UC and I don't honestly believe the 95" motor in an 07 stock UC over the 88" in the 06 is that big a deal. The upgrade from an 88" to a 95" is not that expensive. I am not sure how the issue of modications is going to shake itself out. The initial reports seem to indicate that from 07 on, you buy an H-D and leave it as is if you want to retain your warranty. If that does prove to be the case, then I would think that pre 07 model years would hold their value better since 90% of all H-D owners end up swapping out pipes, intake, and various other performance items. Personally, I am not going to buy another new H-D until the factory produces a water cooled touring bike. AND, whatever that bike ends up being, I will leave it stock and happily so. I will probably end up having two or more different motors for Elvis and let that ride be my fix for my need to mess with chit. LOL  As I said on another post, I am pleased with the 07 model lineup. Back in the 30's H-D produced an 80" motor. For 60 years that was as big as it got. Then from 99 to 07 we've gone all the way to 110. I think the MoCo is doing well, balancing tradition with the need to compete with ever changing technology their competitors put on the street. The only thing I wish they'd do is let you order a bike set-up the way you want it vice buying it one way and investing a bunch more money in changing it. Imagine if you could start with a basic model, go through the catalogue and order paint, chrome, motor, trans etc in the configuration you wanted. Now there's something to dream about.

Adios
        Big B

[kazumdgc]

Just a note, after I made the deposit on my 07, the sales guy told me the service manager got word from the owner to add true duals, and about 5K in additional bling to the bike. Thank God I had it before they did their stuff or it would have been 45K- needless to say I think they will sell pipes do what ever to make a buck. I could be wrong but.... time will tell.
Later