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[lilcoot]

Hey, guys,

I found a problem with my new Hayden primary chain tensioner and have a couple questions.  While doing some motor work this fall, I decided to replace my compensator, which was prematurely worn out according to Jim at Metal Dragon (hd_dude here).  After reading about the issues with the HD compensators, I decided to try out the BDL compensator.  I don't mind being the guinea pig, as long as it's me doing the damage to my stuff. 

At the same time, I replaced the tensioner with the Hayden M6 because I'd heard so much positive feedback about it, and a lot of negative about the newer HD tensioner.  When I finished the other work and started it up, I felt a noticeable improvement.  Compensator noise and shifting were much better, as advertised.  After a few rides, my bike was running great.  Took the bike to get dynotuned in Hayward (about an 800 mile round trip), and during the trip, started hearing a noise at idle.  The compensator sounded like a can of beans bouncing around the primary, but just at idle.

I assumed the BDL comp was the problem, and thought it must be a POS.  So, I figured the HD comp was the lesser of the two evils, and replaced the BDL with a new HD comp.  There were all kinds of metal dust and shavings in the primary oil and on the plug magnet. While disassembling the primary, I noticed the BDL compensator still looked pristine.  Anyway, I installed the new HD compensator, and when I went to install the Hayden tensioner, I realized that the larger of the two springs was broken.  (see pics) 

The noise was probably the loose primary chain that wasn't getting tightened by the new Hayden tensioner.  The BDL compensator was not the problem, and as far as I can tell, it's a good product.  I've already installed the new HD comp, so I'm going to leave it there for now.

Sorry to be so long, but now I have a couple questions:

-Has anyone else had spring breakage problems with the Hayden M6 tensioner?

-Has any damage been done by riding my bike with an inadequately tightened primary chain?

-There were a lot of metal shavings and dust in the primary oil and coating the case and clutch.  Will this damage the clutch mechanism, wear it out prematurely?  I plan on replacing the primary oil after the first ride to flush out the residual metal.

Thanks in advance for any input.

Dan

[lilcoot]

Another pic

[Aussie]

IMO, Noise at idle would have been chain slapping around, not a good thing to have too much slack in the chain, this could cause premature chain wear, however as for the spring breaking that is a major concern.
Had the second spring let go you would have had pieces of wire floating around the primary.

Are there any wear or rub marks on the inner surfaces of the primary?

[moscooter]

 
I have used the M6 in previous Harleys with very good results and some police harleys use them also I've been told.  My current HD uses the HB125 tensioner put out by I don't recall who.......

Here is another link where one of the responders had a broken spring like you and Hayden sent him a new one.

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=57825.0

[hdbrad03]

I'e been looking at both of theese products. Really interested in your or anyone opions on the new BDL compensator. It looks like an interesting concept. Any input greatly appreciated.

 

    Brad

[muddypaws]

I was just going to change over to Hayden. Now I'm concerned if the spring breaks and caused other damage there goes my warranty.

[moscooter]

 

Here is more info on the HB-125 from Sohot bikes

http://www.sohotbikes.com/wedge.html

[mattm]

Glad to see the HB Wedge is available again.  Now I have to figure out which one to use (Hayden or HB).

[Kathy]

 The only time we have ever had spring issues ( having been selling M6s 25 years) is when it is installed the spring pressure is not correctly set. That is the most important part of the installation and if too loose, the springs will 'dance' around and sometimes cause one of them to pop. Part of our design is 2 springs so if something happens to one, the other one holds them both in place. We rarely ever have to send out replacement springs. Please call or email us your address so we can send some to you and give the M6 another try. We're here to help.

[Aussie]

Wouldn't there be excessive chain slap with only the one spring tension?

[Kathy]

Not necessarily. The two springs together produce the correct amount of tension necessary for the unit to function properly. If one spring were to break, the remaining spring will keep to product intact until they can be replaced. It may or may not cause chain slap.

[Aussie]

Not necessarily. The two springs together produce the correct amount of tension necessary for the unit to function properly. If one spring were to break, the remaining spring will keep to product intact until they can be replaced. It may or may not cause chain slap !!

Before any damage is done to the chain how would you know a spring is broken?

[Kathy]

Before any damage is done to the chain how would you know a spring is broken?

When a spring breaks it doesn't have the correct amount of tension on the system and it will be noisier than the normal quiet installation that is so common with the M6. You'll notice it right away.

If you have any questions, please let us know. We're here to help.

[lilcoot]

Kathy, I'll send a PM with my info.  I thought that I installed it exactly according to the directions, but you're saying it was probably too loose and needed a spacer? 

I've re-installed the HD tensioner and a new compensator (HD, too).  The shift action is definitely clunkier and less smooth without the M6 and the BDL comp. But my concern is more noise now.  There's a howl/whine coming from the compensator from idle to 2000 rpm.  Above 2000 rpm, the howl disappears.  It's much louder than the original set up that came stock.  It sounds like a loud turbocharger, and once when I pulled into a gas station, someone asked me if my bike had a turbo installed. 

As soon as I get the spring from Hayden, I'm going to go back to the M6 and BDL compensator set up.  I'm really curious to see how the BDL compensator stands up in the long run.

What is causing the whine/howl from the HD compensator? My original compensator made the whining sound occasionally, but not like this. Could the HD tensioner be ratcheted up too tight and not releasing?  Or is there a more fundamental problem, like an unbalanced crank? Just wondering why I'm having issues with two different HD compensators on an almost new bike.

Wouldn't there be excessive chain slap with only the one spring tension?

Aussie, I'm sure that's what was making the noise.  I found some small marks inside the primary housing where the chain appeared to have rubbed.  That would explain the metal dust/shavings on the plug magnet and in the oil.  I cringe when I think of what could happen if both springs broke.

I'e been looking at both of theese products. Really interested in your or anyone opions on the new BDL compensator. It looks like an interesting concept. Any input greatly appreciated.

 

    Brad

Brad, I'm no mechanical engineer, but the BDL looks like a very well thought out unit.  The HD comp looks like they threw a bunch of parts together from a general parts bin and came up with a makeshift unit.  The BDL is basically 2 pieces plus a couple teflon-like washers, and feels like it's half the weight of the HD comp.  None of these things would make the BDL better, it's just my impression.  Too bad BDL couldn't sell the design to HD.

Dan

[Aussie]

Wine...Sounds like your chain is to tight, best to check chain tension.
You can do a quick check by taking the clutch cover off and check chain tension at top (between comp and clutch basket) using a screw driver or something similar make sure you have at least 1/2 min movement in chain.
Its only an eye ball check but better to have some movement in the chain rather than a piano tight chain.