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[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

SO for those with a 2013 CVO how do you like the clutch?  I just tuned one with our cam ex and I have to say that you will not see the same peak numbers. The clutch will slip then gra re slip and the engine seems to really struggle to get spooling up.. I am going to look into this further but at this point I have to say the slipper clutch is one thing that I was not happy about tuning or riding the bike.
It has a very weird feel to it. But I am not a ABS fan either as my riding style is not suited for it. Here is a sheet and when the bike is making the pull you can feel it hook , then slip hook back up then slip . 

[grc]

The "slipper" A&S clutch is only supposed to slip when the rear wheel is driving the engine, not the other way around.  I'm guessing that once again Harley has managed to take an old piece of technology, adapt it to their bikes, and screw it up in the process.  Maybe they went a bit overboard when they reduced the spring pressure to reduce lever effort?

Sport bikes, and even the V-Rod if I'm not mistaken, have had "slipper" clutches for quite awhile now. 

Jerry

[sadunbar]

SO for those with a 2013 CVO how do you like the clutch?  I just tuned one with our cam ex and I have to say that you will not see the same peak numbers. The clutch will slip then gra re slip and the engine seems to really struggle to get spooling up.. I am going to look into this further but at this point I have to say the slipper clutch is one thing that I was not happy about tuning or riding the bike.
It has a very weird feel to it. But I am not a ABS fan either as my riding style is not suited for it. Here is a sheet and when the bike is making the pull you can feel it hook , then slip hook back up then slip . 

You're dyno sheet is an example of how the slipper is not supposed to work..  Either something is wrong with it, or the Moco design of a slipper clutch is lacking... 

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

graph posted is a WOT pull in 5th gear 6th was really bad.  

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

I took a few pics of it and upload to cloud but .. well its the cloud so maybe I will find them later ha ha .. But it is a 3 spring triangle set up.. I was trying to find a photo of it. I did not mess with it. The CVO is hyd clutch so that is what it is.  well for a slipper it does what its called   

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

here is what you get in a 2013,  I have to say its like looking at a old 3 finger shovel clutch set up 

[hrdtail78]

I had a graph that looked like that on a 08 CVO hyd clutch.  The pushrod never had any free play in it.  I shorten the rod a bit and it helped.  Might be a hyd problem and not a slipper clutch problem.

Speaking of primary's.  I am cracking into mine today.

[miker]

Jeez you mean that ain't? 

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

Thought of that but the clutch was letting out low to mid range .. with that great hyd lack of feel you get ..

[grc]

Fortunately if it turns out that the new A&S clutch is like the SE Compensator (a POS), at least you can convert back to the previous design clutch.  I'm not exactly sure what Harley hoped to achieve by adding this, but the only advantages I can think of would be reduced clutch lever effort thanks to the new lighter spring, and a little protection from shock loading on the crank when banging downshifts.

If this plays out like other recent changes, you will probably see a new SE version in the catalog to fix the issues of the standard POS, at customer expense of course.  Kind of like the SE compensator to replace the total POS stock part in the '07-'09 models, and the SE primary chain tensioner (manual) to replace the POS automatic tensioner.

Jerry

[sadunbar]

Fortunately if it turns out that the new A&S clutch is like the SE Compensator (a POS), at least you can convert back to the previous design clutch.  I'm not exactly sure what Harley hoped to achieve by adding this, but the only advantages I can think of would be reduced clutch lever effort thanks to the new lighter spring, and a little protection from shock loading on the crank when banging downshifts.

If this plays out like other recent changes, you will probably see a new SE version in the catalog to fix the issues of the standard POS, at customer expense of course.  Kind of like the SE compensator to replace the total POS stock part in the '07-'09 models, and the SE primary chain tensioner (manual) to replace the POS automatic tensioner.

Jerry

My understanding from my MOCO engineering friend is the primary purpose of the slipper clutch is yet another protective device for the driveline, particularly the crankshaft..

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

That pic is not what I saw in the CVO the list up top is what the CVO has.. But on the SE comp we do make a solution to that   called the compensaver  


Ok so its going to help save the crank etc.. Man at what point does it take for these guys to see that poor parts are just poor parts?  Put another band aid on a band aid.. Makes no sense to me but what do I know I

[joe_lyons50023]

You can just press the center out b/c the basket is the same part # or just buy a different clutch.  I think there may be something else going on with that thing I have seen quite a few A&S clutches do pretty well and I think Barnett sell kits for them now too with springs also.

[Twolanerider]

My understanding from my MOCO engineering friend is the primary purpose of the slipper clutch is yet another protective device for the driveline, particularly the crankshaft..

So....  On one hand is the option of building more and more slop and loss and (as deployed by Harley) weakness in to the system to protect weak crankshafts.  Things that increase the part number count, add engineering and R&D time, adds shop times both in training and repair (as this is Harley so it's a truism the changes will also be shortcuts and won't hold up).  Or.... on the other, spend a hundred bucks more per bike (and probably not nearly that much) and use good crankshafts to begin with.

[GMR-PERFORMANCE]

Joe you work at Big Barn HD right? so the pic I put up verse the the other what have you seen first hand.. ?  I have not delt with on other than on this 13 CVO.  I know what I saw in the primary and it did not look like that cartoon pic