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Author Topic: Starting bike in Neutral  (Read 13133 times)

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FLHTCUSE7

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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #75 on: November 06, 2013, 05:32:03 PM »

Leaving a car in neutral and setting the parking brake....

Ever see a parking brake cable snap and watch the car go rolling down a driveway into a busy street? (True Story)



Also parking brakes could  freeze in place in cold weather, had it happened a few times in the Army when some careless soldier applied it by mistake when parking for the night
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Twolanerider

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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #76 on: November 06, 2013, 07:05:25 PM »

Leaving a car in neutral and setting the parking brake....

Ever see a parking brake cable snap and watch the car go rolling down a driveway into a busy street? (True Story)



Have had that happen to one of my own.  Fortunately cable broke as the hand brake was being applied.  Always park with a manual trans in gear anyway.  So no lesson "learned" on that one that caused me to begin doing so.  No good reason not to.
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spada84

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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #77 on: November 06, 2013, 09:50:01 PM »

I could always tell a difference between starting in neutral vs starting in gear...could always feel the bike want to move when initially hitting the start button when in gear.  100% of the time, I pull the clutch in. 100% of the time I have two fingers on the front brake lever before hitting the starter button.  Both feet on the ground unless I's starting cold, then I do the same routine from the left side of the bike, put on my helmet/gloves, etc and then get on the bike from the left side.  I cannot remember a single time I have ever started the bike with my right foot on the rear brake pedal...I want both feet on the ground "just in case".  Front brake engaged, start the bike, let the idle speed drop to normal, support with right foot, put it in gear, both feet back on the ground, ride off.

Pretty much exactly what I was going to write.  Thanks for doing it for me  :orange:  I usually park in 1st gear, selecting Neutral before "the drill".
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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #78 on: November 06, 2013, 11:05:00 PM »

Pretty much exactly what I was going to write.  Thanks for doing it for me  :orange:  I usually park in 1st gear, selecting Neutral before "the drill".


And a bike that is right at the edge of easy starting, or starting at all, without using compression releases will definitely show you the difference of being in neutral or not.  For some bikes it is the difference between starting or not once heat soaked.
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porthole

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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #79 on: November 06, 2013, 11:27:06 PM »

And a bike that is right at the edge of easy starting, or starting at all, without using compression releases will definitely show you the difference of being in neutral or not.  For some bikes it is the difference between starting or not once heat soaked.



And why I now have CR's on the red bike  :2vrolijk_21:
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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #80 on: November 07, 2013, 04:29:31 AM »

Also parking brakes could  freeze in place in cold weather, had it happened a few times in the Army when some careless soldier applied it by mistake when parking for the night

It doesnt get that cold here...
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MrSurly

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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #81 on: November 07, 2013, 10:59:09 AM »

As I asked here:http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=89953.msg1190629#msg1190629

Why would ya park (anything) in neutral?
Waiting with bated breath for proponents to explain the reasoning for this.
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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #82 on: November 07, 2013, 01:52:54 PM »

As I asked here:http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=89953.msg1190629#msg1190629

Why would ya park (anything) in neutral?
Waiting with bated breath for proponents to explain the reasoning for this.

I cannot speak for anyone else. When I did have my garage, :(, I would park my 328 in gear if brakes had gotten wet. I wouldn't use hand brake because it would lock solid and I literally would drag one of the tires out. Might've cracked a coil spring because of it. Rear end would  lift like a jack was under it. Had to rock back and forth to free. When I did change out rear brakes and rotors I found parking shoe was toast. The metal would stick to the inner disc's drum. After that I would park it in the garage ONLY in neutral with parking brake on. Was completely level and I had it adjusted to the point you could lock the rear with four clicks. That was the only time I have used only the hand brake. Because I knew my garage floor was level. Any other occasions it wasn't unattended. I'll do this is if my girl is in passenger seat, its cold out, engine running, seats are on, and I gotta run into butcher shop or something. She'll sit in car and not complain. Parking lot is level, worst case she'd hop seat and take over.

 Long winded explanations, but I wouldn't argue with anyone over using only the handbrake if it's on their property that they know is level or if you gotta leave engine running to keep your passenger happy.

Nor would I argue with anyone leaving in gear only because I have had an issue with e-brake freezing.
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CVO Aqua-Glider

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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #83 on: November 07, 2013, 02:37:52 PM »

I park in gear.  Start in nuetral with foot or hand on brake.
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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #84 on: November 10, 2013, 10:00:27 AM »

What about that wonderful CLUNK and lurch forward after jamming a cold bike into first gear from a neutral start (clutch disengaged of course)? What exact mechanical stresses are at work here? Cannot be good for the drive belt or trans innards. I always park in gear and start with bike in gear with clutch depressed as taught in MSF course. Yeah, there will be clutch drag but so what? I always wait for lights in gear, watching in mirrors in case some doosh coming from the rear maybe doesn't see me, so I can escape and evade. Call me a freak, but unless you screwed with the motor and changed something, that starter is plenty robust to start the bike in gear.
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Twolanerider

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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #85 on: November 10, 2013, 10:08:01 AM »

Anyone who doesn't think there is more drag starting in gear rather than in neutral even with the clutch pulled in isn't old enough to have ever kick started a big bike :huepfenlol2: .
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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #86 on: November 10, 2013, 10:31:28 AM »

Anyone who doesn't think there is more drag starting in gear rather than in neutral even with the clutch pulled in isn't old enough to have ever kick started a big bike :huepfenlol2: .

..or had the bike kick back at their leg...
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porthole

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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #87 on: November 10, 2013, 11:24:29 AM »

Anyone who doesn't think there is more drag starting in gear rather than in neutral even with the clutch pulled in isn't old enough to have ever kick started a big bike :huepfenlol2: .

Sportster knee? - Mine still hurts when I think about it.
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djkak

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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #88 on: November 10, 2013, 07:21:15 PM »

What about that wonderful CLUNK and lurch forward after jamming a cold bike into first gear from a neutral start (clutch disengaged of course)? What exact mechanical stresses are at work here? Cannot be good for the drive belt or trans innards. I always park in gear and start with bike in gear with clutch depressed as taught in MSF course. Yeah, there will be clutch drag but so what? I always wait for lights in gear, watching in mirrors in case some doosh coming from the rear maybe doesn't see me, so I can escape and evade. Call me a freak, but unless you screwed with the motor and changed something, that starter is plenty robust to start the bike in gear.

Prior to the middle of model year 1984, Big Twin’s used a dry clutch that didn’t support starting in gear, or even running in gear on the jiffy stand with the clutch disengaged.

Unlike the various clutch assemblies used since then, the shell of the dry clutch was allowed to move laterally, from side to side, along the bearing surface of the clutch hub. The only thing keeping the clutch shell on the hub was the clutch plates themselves, and of course the front chain.

On any Big Twin built from 1965 through mid ’84, if you engaged the electric starter while the clutch was disengaged, the starter ring gear, attached to the clutch shell, would move away from the starter drive, sometimes resulting in damage to the ring gear and starter drive. You never wanted to do this with the early laminated ring gear.

If your engine was running in gear, with the clutch disengaged, and you set the machine down on the jiffy stand, the clutch shell would move down the clutch hub and stop against the clutch plates, placing some tension on the clutch pack. If the clutch was getting oily and becoming somewhat sticky, you would pause, maybe just a little before doing that again.

The thought of actually starting a dry clutch Big Twin in gear and on the jiffy stand was something that you didn’t do more than a few times. These clutches didn’t disengage that well under ideal conditions, and when they became oily, which was most of the time, since they were running uncovered in a housing lubricated by an oil mist, the engagement was often somewhat harsh.

The Sportster clutches from ’1971 through mid 1984 also had an aggressive personality. The first time that you dropped one of these machines into gear in the morning, it would “chirp” the tire on your garage floor. After the clutch and transmission fluid warmed up, everything was fine. The experience was often so abrupt that it was sometimes referred to as “morning sickness”.
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Re: Starting bike in Neutral
« Reply #89 on: November 11, 2013, 02:26:02 AM »

Sportster knee? - Mine still hurts when I think about it.

My first Harley experience, as a teenaged whippersnapper, was trying to kick start a Duoglide.  Got that knee you refer to on the first attempt.  Folks at the garage watching thought it was a lot funnier than I did.  Was sort of different than kickstarting a 175 cc Kawa.  :huepfenlol2:  2nd try it started.

« Last Edit: November 11, 2013, 02:29:51 AM by iski »
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