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[MDUltra]

I'm wondering if this rally is a breakthrough in tuning?
I guess it's nice having Bluetooth connection and someone to look at your tune (if you choose)

I've got a '12 SE 110 that I'm thinking of replacing the cam and hate the idea of taking the bike to the dealer (have a SERT) and paying to have it dyno'd when I can buy the FP3 and do it myself for the same $$$

Any thoughts?

[05Train]

Looks interesting.  It's amazing watching the tuning tools get better and better.

[grc]

Got a link to whatever it is you're talking about?  New so-called tuning devices are a dime a dozen, with everyone jumping on the bandwagon to sell one, so we need a scorecard to keep up.

Jerry

[05Train]

Got a link to whatever it is you're talking about?  New so-called tuning devices are a dime a dozen, with everyone jumping on the bandwagon to sell one, so we need a scorecard to keep up.

Jerry

http://www.vanceandhines.com/store/vtwin/fuelpak/66005

[grc]

I'm wondering if this rally is a breakthrough in tuning?
I guess it's nice having Bluetooth connection and someone to look at your tune (if you choose)

I've got a '12 SE 110 that I'm thinking of replacing the cam and hate the idea of taking the bike to the dealer (have a SERT) and paying to have it dyno'd when I can buy the FP3 and do it myself for the same $$$

Any thoughts?

Impossible to tell much from the short blurb on their website, but I don't think you can just assume you can "do it yourself" and come up with a result as good as a proper tune from a fully qualified professional.  You already paid for the SEPST you have, and I would suggest finding a good tuner (don't assume your local Harley dealer has someone who is truly good btw) and get the bike tuned.  All the sales pitch BS and hype from the many companies selling little black box solutions should be taken with a HUGE grain of salt.  And btw, it doesn't appear they have a screen like the PV so you would need to use your smart phone to view all that wizbang data while driving down the road.  Just what we need, more people driving and riding distracted.  And the vast majority of people won't know what that data means anyway.  Gimmicks aren't what makes for a good tune.  In fact, a good tune that retains closed loop operation is pretty much self maintaining on a modern system, and you don't need to be constantly monitoring data and screwing with the tune.

Jerry

[hrdtail78]

a couple of weeks ago a Vance and Hines rep stop by the shop with my drag rep to give me a presentation on the thing.  This thing reminds my of the superchip stuff, or something out of the car world.

You start by going through a series of questions.  Year, model, cubic inch, exhaust, and intake.  It comes up with a map and you flash it.  The only pipes I saw was V&H.  Rep said they were going to add more.  Cam question was lacking.  Rep said they were going to add later.  Intake was only V&H, rep said they would add more later.  You do have access to VE tables but the rep didn't know how to record data to change them to your bike.  basically at this point I saw a flash base tuner with limited canned downloads.  It comes from the car world and acts like it.  A lot of cold air intakes and cat back exhaust systems.  He did not want to plug it into a bike, but showed it to me in demo mode.

IMO it is lacking at this time, but I do see potential if they make it more toward the Harley world.  It's as only as good as its base maps, and we know where we are with canned map downloads in this world.

[FlaHeatWave]

Why aren't the TTS, DynoJet, and the rest of the Tuner Manufacturers Bluetoothing similar to this?

http://fp3.vanceandhines.com/#fuelpakfp3

'Seems that all that would be needed is a 2 way Bluetooth dongle that plugs into the diagnostic port and the apps???

I know the V&H is just a "fueler" but this (Bluetooth) is the way everything is going...

[Steve Cole]

I cannot answer for anyone but ourselves but if you plan is to collect data and then make corrections from the data collected Blue tooth doesn't cut it. The through put is really to slow for proper collection of the ECM data. We tested this about 2 years ago and determined that if we were to go wireless it would need to be something better than Blue tooth to get accurate data.

[FlaHeatWave]

I cannot answer for anyone but ourselves but if you plan is to collect data and then make corrections from the data collected Blue tooth doesn't cut it. The through put is really to slow for proper collection of the ECM data. We tested this about 2 years ago and determined that if we were to go wireless it would need to be something better than Blue tooth to get accurate data.

Doesn't your New TTS software have internal data logging capabilities?

'Wasn't thinking about collecting data, just transferring data logs from the flash tuned ECM, making the changes in the smartphone, and transferring the new map back to the ECM

The DJ tuning maps that I have are only 3.04kb, about the size of a 3min. song. 'Wouldn't that be about 10min from uploading the data log to remapping???

'Was just thinking about a PowerVision (flash tuner) type device that I could run off of my iPhone... 

[hrdtail78]

Doesn't your New TTS software have internal data logging capabilities?

'Wasn't thinking about collecting data, just transferring data logs from the flash tuned ECM, making the changes in the smartphone, and transferring the new map back to the ECM

Might work for just controlling starting and stopping of recordings.  Bluetooth Data Recording Control start/stop type thing, but you aren't going to see live data at any resolution.  The flight recorder doesn't need this because you set up the recording options before hand.  You can gather hours of data.  Who wants to review all that data and make necessary changes to the cal with all thumbs.




The DJ tuning maps that I have are only 3.04kb, about the size of a 3min. song. 'Wouldn't that be about 10min from uploading the data log to remapping???

Mastertune cals are more around 47-104kb and the ECM isn't friendly if something stops an upload.  3.04   Maybe somebody should ask about this when comparing tuners.


'Was just thinking about a PowerVision (flash tuner) type device that I could run off of my iPhone... 

Are you looking for a bigger screen?

The V&H does allow you to carry several maps, and lets you view live data.  It's low resolution data such as speed, tach, temp and I don't remember....

I really see a place for this w/ the price for Nasi, Camtech, Yaffee ......... Blue tooth to a pad or tablet for the bikes with untraditional inner fairings.  Control music, video, GPS,

[FlaHeatWave]

Are you looking for a bigger screen?

The V&H does allow you to carry several maps, and lets you view live data.  It's low resolution data such as speed, tach, temp and I don't remember....



I really see a place for this w/ the price for Nasi, Camtech, Yaffee ......... Blue tooth to a pad or tablet for the bikes with untraditional inner fairings.  Control music, video, GPS,

'Not comparing tuners, (so thanks for the smart@$$ comment)

'Was just thinking about a PowerVision (flash tuner) type device that I could run off of an iPhone or  iPad, so that I don't have to plug in wires and carry a laptop.
Last year, a Manager told me that Harley is looking to Bluetooth the whole bike, ECM (I guess for the Diagnostic Port?) and all...

[hrdtail78]

My compare comment wasn't toward you.

I'd wait until the new Maximus from Techno Research to come out.

[FlaHeatWave]

My commented toward you.

I'd wait until the new Maximus from Techno Research to come out.

Late last year, the guys doing my machine work told me about the Maximus, but swore me to secrecy until The Expo.

[Steve Cole]

Doesn't your New TTS software have internal data logging capabilities?

All Mastertune2 (blue interface) product has the ability to collect data without a PC of any type.

'Wasn't thinking about collecting data, just transferring data logs from the flash tuned ECM, making the changes in the smartphone, and transferring the new map back to the ECM

The issue as we saw it was that Bluetooth will stop/start on it's own. When you talking over it you might call it static or a missed word, if that happens during programming the ECM, you now have a dead ECM! So the design would required that the transfer from the phone be made to the interface and checked prior to ever starting the ECM programming.The data rate is too slow and unstable to try and use real time.

The DJ tuning maps that I have are only 3.04kb, about the size of a 3min. song. 'Wouldn't that be about 10min from uploading the data log to remapping???

'Was just thinking about a PowerVision (flash tuner) type device that I could run off of my iPhone... 

Lots of options on how to skin the cat, so to speak but these days. They are much better done not using Bluetooth. The truth really is how many people are out there changing there programming once the bike is tuned properly? Once properly done one tune is all that is needed until you change some components on the bike.

[Hilly13]

Change things! ..........who would do that