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[cyco1450]

I have a '11 SESG w/ SE race tuner. Had a Dyno done today that came up 100hp and 103 lb ft torque. Mechanic said if I switched to a PC5, I can get about 110hp and about 115+ lb ft torque.  My buddy says "no way".  Any of you have any thoughts or experience?

[hd-dude]

The tuning device does not dictate the horsepower and torque numbers. The build and the tune does! Be it a TTS, PCV, super tuner, etc... Tuners all have their favorite device and that is why some say that they can get you more with one or the other but it just shows that they lack knowledge in the other devices.

[cyco1450]

I understand it's the tune.  Just wondering if the numbers they are quoting me are realistic? Someone out there must have the same setup.

[willyB]

Keep in mind that dyno numbers are very subjective depending on multiple variables. The dyno device itself, exhaust type, how & when the throttle gets twisted, air temp, air pressure, elevation, etc... Take any bike to 20 different dynos and you'll most likely have 20 different numbers.

So with that said, my 2011 CVO Street Glide with true duals, 4" Rineharts, GMR 577 cams and a TTS tuner pulled 99.15HP/114.31TQ from a very reputable tuner. Prior to the cams it was 89HP/108TQ from a local general tuner with a PCV.

I've looked at multiple dyno sheets on a stock motor and they average 85-95HP and 100-110TQ.

Don't worry so much about the actual dyno numbers. Worry more about how the big runs across the rpm range. Decel pop, stumbles, hard starting when hot, etc...

[grc]

I understand it's the tune.  Just wondering if the numbers they are quoting me are realistic? Someone out there must have the same setup.

Unless I missed it, the only thing you mentioned having was a 2011 SESG and a SEPST.  If that is all you have, then the numbers you mentioned are unrealistically high.  A stock SESG with nothing more than a tune isn't going to come close to 100 hp, no matter what device is used and who does the tuning.

The guy feeding you the story about getting higher numbers with a PC5 (PCV) isn't someone I would bother doing business with.  He's either trying to sell you a PCV, or he just doesn't know what he's talking about.

Jerry

[cyco1450]

I'm running an S&S True Dual header w/ Fullsac 2.25's in stock cans, a SE Racetune and a SE Pro 110 upgrade kit.  the HD catalog states it should be able to produce up to 114hp.  So it's obviously not doing it w/ the SE tuner.  I'm trying to figure out if it will do it w/ the PC5?  as of yesterday's dyno at sea level (done at the beach rally), I'm pulling 100.09hp w/ almost 114 lb. ft. torque.  that's a long way from 114 hp.

[cyco1450]

BTW, that kit is the 10.5:1 pistons and the SE-259E cam.

[grc]

I'm running an S&S True Dual header w/ Fullsac 2.25's in stock cans, a SE Racetune and a SE Pro 110 upgrade kit.  the HD catalog states it should be able to produce up to 114hp.  So it's obviously not doing it w/ the SE tuner.  I'm trying to figure out if it will do it w/ the PC5?  as of yesterday's dyno at sea level (done at the beach rally), I'm pulling 100.09hp w/ almost 114 lb. ft. torque.  that's a long way from 114 hp.

OK, now it makes more sense.  You have the 10.5:1 compression pistons and the 259E cams, and yes Harley does claim that kit can produce UP TO 114 horsepower in a CVO 110 (depending on exhaust and tune of course).

The tuning device and software package, in this case the SEPST, is not what will determine how well this kit will work in your engine.  Did you have a real professional tuner do a full dyno tune, or did your dealer just load the canned map Harley has for that kit and make a run on the dyno to create a chart?  From your question I am guessing they just loaded the Harley map.  As I said before, the guy who fed you that story about the PCV is either just trying to sell you another device that you don't need, or he doesn't have a clue about the subject.  Find yourself a real full time professional to do a complete dyno tune, using the device you already paid for in that kit (SEPST).

Jerry

[cyco1450]

well...sort of both.  the tuner who did the dyno yesterday was "Speeds" who is at all the rallies.  the issue is not tuning the SERT, it's time and cost.  HD does not release their tune software to anyone, so tuning the HD unit is essentially manual and trial and error.  he said it could take hours.  whereas, the Dynotune software can do the same thing in about 45 minutes and be more accurate.  he couldn't charge enough for his time to work on the HD at a price I'd pay.

so back to my original question - will I get to the 114 or so if re-tuned? I'm willing to be my life that the HD shop mechanic who installed the RT is NOT a "tuner" or spent 3 hours dialing it in. (FYI- I bought bike used w/ 1500 miles).

[grc]

well...sort of both.  the tuner who did the dyno yesterday was "Speeds" who is at all the rallies.  the issue is not tuning the SERT, it's time and cost.  HD does not release their tune software to anyone, so tuning the HD unit is essentially manual and trial and error.  he said it could take hours.  whereas, the Dynotune software can do the same thing in about 45 minutes and be more accurate.  he couldn't charge enough for his time to work on the HD at a price I'd pay.

so back to my original question - will I get to the 114 or so if re-tuned? I'm willing to be my life that the HD shop mechanic who installed the RT is NOT a "tuner" or spent 3 hours dialing it in. (FYI- I bought bike used w/ 1500 miles).

Say what?  Anyone with $39.95 can buy the software CD for the SEPST, and can also buy the training DVD for another $39.95.  What this guy is really doing is using Dynojet's automated system to do his tune so he can crank out many more "tunes" per day and make a lot more money.  I've got a so-called Dynojet Tuning Center within a few miles of me, and that's what they use.  The resulting tunes are far from great, but they sure can crank them out fast.

If you pay this guy another $300 - $400 for the PCV on top of whatever he charges for that automated tune, how is that better than just paying a good professional tuner $300 - $400 to do a complete tune using the SEPST you already paid for in the kit?  And we haven't even started talking about the fact that the PCV tune will be open loop.

No one can guarantee you 114 hp, no matter what software package, device, and dyno they might use.  Assuming your engine is in good mechanical condition and your exhaust system doesn't suck, you should be able to do much better than the 100 you reported earlier.  I've seen reports from several others with that kit that claimed horsepower after a decent tune in the 105-110 range.

Before you let this "Speeds" guy sell you a bill of goods, check around your area for a full time pro tuner who uses SEPST and see what he has to say.  In this day and age an add-on box device like the PCV is not the optimum solution, even if you could find a really good tuner to use it.

Jerry

[cyco1450]

thanx Jerry...you epitomize the greatness of this Forum and the helpfulness of its members.  I'm going to look around for a Harley shop/dealer who has a reputable tuner to try and dial my bike in. that's probably my best bet as they will have the software and familiarity with it.

[North Star]

If you tell us where you're from, I'm sure somebody knows of a good tuner in your area.

[cyco1450]

I'm from philadelphia.

[bxbutch]

best tuner I know Ken at BLACK HILLS CUSTOMS in NEW JERSEY  call him   Butch

[cyco1450]

best tuner I know Ken at BLACK HILLS CUSTOMS in NEW JERSEY  call him   Butch

Thx.