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[grc]

There are reduce reach levers available for hyd clutches. I installed a set on my flstfse2 to improve the disability for my wife. I can't confirm or deny the condition the OP is describing, but I had no problems.  Maybe something changed in years after 06?

Actually there aren't any short reach levers designed for the hydraulic clutch bikes.  I assume you installed levers that were designed for a cable clutch bike, just like the OP.  But in your case with a 2006 motorcycle, you wouldn't have the same problem she is having because a 2006 Harley didn't have the clutch interlock system.  That was a new (to Harley) thing added for the 2007 model year.  The problem you would have with those levers would be reduced travel of the clutch release system, allowing for clutch drag. 

Jerry

[grc]

if the clutch were partially engaged, the bike could still start, it would just lurch.  a lot.  the op didn't make any mention of said lurching when attempting to start, so i still think it's a neutral switch problem.  which takes us back to the aftermarket levers.

There have been many similar complaints about not cranking with the bike in gear and the clutch lever pulled in, going all the way back to 2007, when people have installed certain aftermarket clutch levers (and not just the reduced reach versions).  Some levers didn't have enough of a "tang" to depress the clutch switch completely, so the bike wouldn't crank in gear even though the clutch lever was pulled in.  Changing back to the Harley levers would fix the issue, or modifying the aftermarket levers to add material to contact the switch plunger could also work.

Getting the switch to work is just one issue with the reduced reach levers though.  Even if you modify the lever to be able to fully depress the switch, you would still have the other problem of insufficient travel to eliminate clutch drag. 

Jerry

[tysndys]

Actually there are reduced reach levers for hydraulic clutch bikes. Normally I just make chit up but this time a quick trip to the hoarders nest proved fruitful. Attached are the photos.

[tysndys]

These were touted as reduced reach.

[OBB]

Been following the thread and I wonder if the Clutchwiz will help the OP holding that clutch lever in at a stop while using the stock levers.

[grc]

Actually there are reduced reach levers for hydraulic clutch bikes. Normally I just make chit up but this time a quick trip to the hoarders nest proved fruitful. Attached are the photos.

   I wasn't trying to say you were making chit up, but I did like that little comeback.  But my previous post is still correct.  Just because the folks selling those levers put that on the label doesn't mean they are truly a good substitution in an engineering sense.  They can change the shape of the lever, but they can't change the laws of physics.  The reduced reach lever will bottom out against the grip quicker, before the master cylinder pushrod moves through it's full travel.  Therefore the clutch release rod and plate will not move as far either, and that can lead to clutch drag.  Many of the early CVO hydraulic clutches suffered from a certain amount of drag even with the stock levers, so reducing the lever travel certainly wouldn't be good for those bikes.  Harley does not sell reduced reach replacement levers for the hydraulic clutch bikes for this very reason.  Even the legit aftermarket companies note that their reduced reach levers are for cable clutch bikes only these days. 

Jerry

[grc]

Been following the thread and I wonder if the Clutchwiz will help the OP holding that clutch lever in at a stop while using the stock levers.

That's why I mentioned it to her in my early post.  Another lady on the site went through this same scenario on a Touring model some time back, and eventually took care of her problem by installing the Clutch Wiz after we explained there was no legitimate lever change that would fix her problem.  My feeble mind just can't pull her name up right now or I'd recommend harleygirl12 contact her directly for her input.

Jerry

OK, my feeble mind finally caught up.  It was LovemyCVOgirl (Judy) that installed the clutch wiz.

[OBB]

That's why I mentioned it to her in my early post.  Another lady on the site went through this same scenario on a Touring model some time back, and eventually took care of her problem by installing the Clutch Wiz after we explained there was no legitimate lever change that would fix her problem.  My feeble mind just can't pull her name up right now or I'd recommend harleygirl12 contact her directly for her input.

Jerry

OK, my feeble mind finally caught up.  It was LovemyCVOgirl (Judy) that installed the clutch wiz.

I missed that. Must have been in one of your really short responses that I didn't read. 

I installed the clutchwiz in mine also but along with it, a stiffer spring. It does make the pull a little easier but I'm sure if I left the stock spring in there,, it would make a really noticeable difference.

[sadunbar]

Actually there are reduced reach levers for hydraulic clutch bikes. Normally I just make chit up but this time a quick trip to the hoarders nest proved fruitful. Attached are the photos.

I'm not aware of a reduced reach clutch for the OP's 2012 bike with a hydraulic clutch...since the addition of the micro switch.  Doesn't mean there isn't one out there...I'm just not aware of one. 

[Dan_Lockwood]

I'm not trying to stir things up any, but I have a picture of clutch levers in my mind and I'll throw it out.

On a hydraulic clutch, the pivot pin for the function of the lever is outboard and the "push" part of the lever for the master cylinder piston is inboard.

With a cable clutch, the pivot pin for the function of the lever in inboard and the "pull" part of the lever that the cable snatches into is outboard.

In my mind there would be no way to even install a cable lever on a hydraulic clutch lever assembly.  So how could anyone even mount a cable lever on a hydraulic setup?

Just asking and I could very well be missing something as my mind's picture is often out of focus... 

[grc]

You're absolutely correct Dan, the actual working end of the levers is different and wouldn't work if you mixed them.  I guess a better way to say what I was trying to say is that the hand lever end of the clutch lever can't be made to match the "short reach" design of the levers offered for cable clutch models.  Some companies have obviously tried to do so, but using that design on a hydraulic lever will result in reduced travel of the piston in the master cylinder, which can cause clutch drag.  On a cable clutch you have some leeway because you have two freeplay adjustments on the cable models that you can tweak to give you enough travel to release the clutch completely.  Unfortunately those adjustments don't apply to hydraulic clutches.

I still haven't been able to find levers for late model hydraulic clutch bikes that even claim to be reduced reach.  If someone is out there selling such an item it wouldn't surprise me, but that doesn't mean it's a legitimate solution.  Btw, installing fat grips also causes the same problem on hydraulic clutch bikes, for the same reason.  The lever bottoms out on the grip before the working end can move the M/C piston through it's full travel.  Lots of folks found that out back in the first few years Harley had hydraulic clutches on the CVO's.

Jerry

[Dan_Lockwood]

Jerry, thanks.

Hydraulics do NOT compress so it's a 1:1 ratio, master to slave.  Better put would be to say that 1 oz. displacement from the master cylinder will provide 1 oz. of fluid input to the slave cylinder.  I realize that the master slave are different bores and require different stroke length to provide proper function to disengage the clutch fully and release it without any slippage.

The only way in my mind to use a "short reach" lever would be to have an over bored master cylinder that puts out say 20% more fluid for the same amount of stroke, or in this case, puts out the same amount of fluid for 20% less stroke on the lever.

After thinking about the OP and the problem with reach and the comment about bike week etc, I wonder if it's reach or effort that's the biggest problem.

I know I have no issue reaching my clutch lever, but because I don't ride enough to keep my left hand strong enough, or I could blame it on getting older, fatigue in my fingers happens quite quickly in stop and go traffic.  In this case a lighter pull clutch would benefit me, but a short reach lever would do nothing for my fatigue.

"IF" I had a short reach lever and a larger bore master cylinder, I would see an increased amount of force necessary to get the same amount of fluid to the slave cylinder.  If it were a 20% reduced reach, read "travel", I would see about a 20% increase in lever pressure and my poor little "old" fingers would be sore very quickly.  Of course the percentages are just my wild guess, but they seem right to me.

[grc]

One of the problems with the hydraulic clutch is that any change to the master or slave cylinders to generate more travel at the slave with less travel at the master will also increase the lever effort, and usually those who seek a shorter reach are also looking for less effort, not more.  There really is no simple answer to the desire for a shorter reach with less effort on a Harley.  Something like the Clutch Wiz can help the effort issue, assuming you don't increase the clutch spring rate, but then you face the tradeoff between effort and clutch capacity.  And it still doesn't do anything for those who just can't reach the lever.

Jerry

[grc]

Oh, btw, I did some more searching and finally did find that Kuryakyn Boss Blade lever they claim will work on a '99 through '06 hydraulic clutch bike.  They don't exactly call it a reduced reach lever, but due to the dished out area toward the grip perhaps it does allow a small amount of reduced reach without reducing travel too much.  It's hard to tell without having both levers in hand to make comparative measurements.  This is from the Kury website description of the product:  Boss Blades are a stunning addition to our line of custom levers. Their wide, deeply dished blades greet your fingers with the shortest reach possible while still allowing the necessary range of motion.
1036 Boss Blades (pr)   Fits: '99-'06 Twin Cams with H-D's Hydraulic Clutch and '02-'05 V-Rod

You'll note this lever isn't for '07 and later models, which tells me it isn't made to work with the clutch switch that was incorporated for 2007 and later.  Perhaps this is the lever the dealer installed on harleygirl12's bike, and if it is then there is no doubt in my mind why her bike won't start in gear with the clutch lever pulled in.

Jerry

[harleygirl12]

The Harley dealer did indeed tell me that the kuryakyn boss blade levers they installed do NOT have that doo-hickey that allows the bike to be started in gear.   I am very interested in the clutch wiz and will look into it...thank you "grc" and all the other comments.  The new levers ARE a lot easier to use and it seems I have a lot more control (engages quickly and smoothly) as I change gears.  Not as much fatigue.

Howevr, I'm considering having the stock levers reinstalled and see if I can add the clutch wiz.