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Author Topic: 110 Seized Oil Pump  (Read 2227 times)

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SimonNottsUK

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110 Seized Oil Pump
« on: September 17, 2014, 01:12:34 PM »

Well, 19,400 miles and 3.5 years into my use of my FLTRUSE and the oil warning light comes on. Bike recovered by Chester HD.

Dealership master tech tells me the oil pump is shot, inner gerotor has seized solid on crankshaft.

Engine has had it, bits of metal all over :oops:

Repair cost, with no guarantees upwards of £5,000. or new Harley 110 at £7,500.

Just spoke to HD UK customer services, they will look at what, if anything they can do.

Oh, the joy of owning a Harley.

Welcome suggestions, but bear in mind new engines of any type are very expensive over here.

Simon
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HILLSIDECYCLE.COM

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Re: 110 Seized Oil Pump
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2014, 01:15:19 PM »

What caused that to occur, would be what I'd want to know.
Crank sissored?
Scott
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SimonNottsUK

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Re: 110 Seized Oil Pump
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2014, 01:19:16 PM »

Going up to have chat and get some answers next time I'm off, next Tuesday. (its 120 miles away)

Lets see if Harley stand behind their product, I have a full UK dealer history, so no excuses.

Simon
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grc

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Re: 110 Seized Oil Pump
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2014, 03:26:29 PM »


Definitely sounds like one of Harley's high quality and high precision (or was that high runout?) crankshafts.  This is exactly why so many of us were flabbergasted when Harley changed their runout specs to allow tons of defective crankshafts to suddenly become good parts.  Oil pumps aren't designed to cope with excessive runout, and will eventually fail.

Sorry to hear about your failure, and I certainly hope Harley steps up to help, regardless of warranty status.   

Jerry
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BigLew

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Re: 110 Seized Oil Pump
« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2014, 04:16:59 PM »

Yep, good luck with that.

BigLew
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trippy

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Re: 110 Seized Oil Pump
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2014, 04:19:15 PM »

Hi Simon,
Sorry to hear of your problems, had similar lack of support from my dealer in London (East) over the "Compensator Issue" had 4 of slightly different variants, but only because of HD UK, Finally fixed it with the 2014 SE Comp plus the  "Compensaver" from GMR, as to your situation it does sound like "Crank Runout" causing the oil pump to be trashed, mine is at a steady 4 thou out of true so as soon as I can afford to fix it, will be having the crank rebuilt with Timken bearing conversion.  Good luck.    Mark.
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Dan_Lockwood

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Re: 110 Seized Oil Pump
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2014, 09:44:18 AM »

Hi Simon,
Sorry to hear of your problems, had similar lack of support from my dealer in London (East) over the "Compensator Issue" had 4 of slightly different variants, but only because of HD UK, Finally fixed it with the 2014 SE Comp plus the  "Compensaver" from GMR, as to your situation it does sound like "Crank Runout" causing the oil pump to be trashed, mine is at a steady 4 thou out of true so as soon as I can afford to fix it, will be having the crank rebuilt with Timken bearing conversion.  Good luck.    Mark.

This reminds me of the some car issues I've had as well as some of the drag racers.

I'm not sure how rigid the HD crank is from side to side, but can an out of balance comp going south cause issues with the oil pump on the opposite side?  I know this is probably not Simon's issue, but...

I know this is a bit off topic, but I'm sure some of the engine builders here will like the short story.

In my street rod powered with a blown 392 hemi, I had a torque converter blow up on me and at the time I didn't notice much other than the convert vibrated badly.  After replacing the converter and running it again, I had a bad oil leak on the rear crank seal.  Upon further inspection I found that the seal had been burned to a crisp, so I replaced it.  Later the seal started to leak again a little so this time I took out the pan and dropped the rear main cap.  I found that I had taken out the rear main bearing.  The main bearings that the engine builder used was King Bearings from Israel.  What had happened was that the bearing material got so hot it fused to the crank like solder and then pulled away from the bearing.  I had great oil pressure and no noise or vibration.  I told the engine builder what had happened and he told me that the convert blowing up took out the rear main in a seconds and the fused and kept running.  But in the process got so hot it fried the rubber rear seal.  Originally the hemis had rope rear seals and it seems a 440 rear main fits okay enough to be silicone in place.





You can see the wider groove which had a matching amount of material fused to my crank. 

When I've seen mains or rods go out, they've ALWAYS spun the bearing on the crank and took out the block as well as the crank.  My engine guy said that if he had used Clevite or Michigan 77 bearings, instead of getting new bearings and seal from him, I'd be looking for a new block and crank.  He said that's why he always uses the King Bearings on all of his circle track and tractor pull motors.  I'm glad he did on my motor as well.

It took me almost 8 hours of hand cleaning of the crank to remove all the bearing material.  Of course I had an assembled motor and was working through the lower rear main opening.  I used an Exacto knife and very fine emery cloth and would wok on about a 1/4" at a time and then rotate the crank just a bit and start all over again.  Just before I sold the car, 10k miles later, I pulled the pan again and the rear main cap to see how things were holding up on my repair, it could use a new seal at the time too.  The crank had just a shiny spot here and there, but no scuffing or circular scratches and the main bearing was nice looking too.  I sure do have seller's remorse on that car though.

In the early days of drag racing and blowers, it was not uncommon to take out the front main bearing when a blower belt blew.  Lots of heavy duty front mains were developed for that reason.

Now as far as a HD goes, could the comp when bad enough transfer the vibration to the other side of the motor and take out the oil pump?

Sorry for rambling guys.
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Dan

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Re: 110 Seized Oil Pump
« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2014, 07:21:16 AM »

What generally causes the pump to fail is that the pinion shaft run out, gyro's it into a mess.
Scott
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