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[kojak]

HD-Dude, you are correct with the pc3/usb version, a tuning center can tune individual cylinder maps. I was referring to the cylinder trim feature which limits the amount of fuel you can adjust going to each cylinder. Below is info directly from Dynojet. I guess on the new version, you can also use the rev-extend so you wouldnt need the stage 1 download.
"Individual cylinder adjustment - All PCIII USB units have a "cylinder
trim" adjustment feature that allows you to "offset" fuel to one or more
cylinders. Additionally, for advanced users, the PCIII USB allows individual
cylinder mapping. Now each cylinder can be mapped individually
throughout the entire rpm/throttle position range."
"Dynojet Research is please to announce two new features for
the Harley Davidson Power Commanders. - The first new feature
is "Rev X-tend". This will give you the ability to have an
increased rev limit over stock without having to modify the bike's ECM.
No longer will you need to take the bike to the dealer to have the ECM
"reflashed" in order to have the higher rev limit your bike needs with
modified cams, heads, etc. For information on activating this feature
please visit www.powercommander.com
The second new feature is "Start Fuel". This allows you to add additional
fuel during startup. On heavily modified and/or large displacement
engines (i.e 124 ci) extra fuel is sometimes required to ease starting.
This is a software adjustable setting that makes it possible to
increase the amount of fuel injected into the engine during crankin"

[e4seter]

Is the PC reliable these days? Is investing in a spare PC a wise move or waste of money?

Absolute waste of money.  If the PCIII or any piggy back devise craps out, pull it out of the circuit, and if the bike runs with just the stock ecm,  then ride it slowly, and listen for any knock, rattle, or strange noises.  You will be able to always get the bike home with light throttle, as long as you do not push or lug it.  Common sense always is correct. [ch61514]

[Hoist!]

Absolute waste of money.  If the PCIII or any piggy back devise craps out, pull it out of the circuit, and if the bike runs with just the stock ecm,  then ride it slowly, and listen for any knock, rattle, or strange noises.  You will be able to always get the bike home with light throttle, as long as you do not push or lug it.  Common sense always is correct. [ch61514]

Thanks again, that's what I thought. Especially with just A/C and slip-ons. I am going to Dyno it with the SPO's and A/C before installing the PC, as Harry suggested. This way I'll know what to expect from that set-up with a stock ECM. Hoist! 8-)

[Jester_Red07]

I am a member of the ThunderMax closed loop club. It doesn't get any better than that.

    Questions on the TMax?
1)Does it completly replace the HD ECM, Or work in conjunction with it?
2) Does it leave any evidence behind , If removed for warranty purposes?
3) What is the level of difficulty to install and tune?

[bisounours]

1) Yes, TMax replace completly the HD ECM.
2) Of course, You loose the HD Warranty, It's the most important point.  
Today, I think that it's the best and up to date product on the market. [smiley=xyxthumbs.gif]
3) I invite you to download the manuel on the websit of ThunderMax :
http://www.thunder-max.com/Support/FuelInjectionInstructions.aspx
The manuel is very clear.
Some users explain their own experiences and their satisfactions in others threads. 8-)

Regards
Jacques

[Chief]

Thank you very much. That's been my conclusion and was looking for a little reassurance, I guess. Is the PC reliable these days? [highlight]Is investing in a spare PC a wise move or waste of money?[/highlight]

IMO, yes. Trying to buy anything spare anticipating failure, except for fuses and bulbs, is a wild goose chase. You can achieve the same level of security by carrying a printout of your map.

The map serves two purposes. You can use it to program a replacement unit if needed, and if you're stuck on the side of the road, you can turn it over and write "HELP" on the back.

Chief

[Hoist!]

IMO, yes. Trying to buy anything spare anticipating failure, except for fuses and bulbs, is a wild goose chase. You can achieve the same level of security by carrying a printout of your map.

The map serves two purposes. You can use it to program a replacement unit if needed, and if you're stuck on the side of the road, you can turn it over and write "HELP" on the back.

Chief

Hey Chief, thanks. What format would be best to carry that spare map along besides the printout to cry for help? Can you burn a CD and carry that with you, to simply load into the new PC? You're right, a back-up map would allow you to find a PC and reinstall your dyno'd map back in it. You'd be back on the road i no time. You wouldn/t have to get it tuned after installing. Just plug it in and go. Thanks. Hoist! 8-)

[Chief]

Hey Chief, thanks. What format would be best to carry that spare map along besides the printout to cry for help? Can you burn a CD and carry that with you, to simply load into the new PC? You're right, a back-up map would allow you to find a PC and reinstall your dyno'd map back in it. You'd be back on the road i no time. You wouldn/t have to get it tuned after installing. Just plug it in and go. Thanks. Hoist! 8-)

Well, its all up to you. the map files are tiny, about 5kb each. If I were going to carry an electronic copy with me, I'd opt for a cheap flash drive. This requires the person to have a USB port on their computer. This is almost a given for a laptop, but I don't know if the DJ-250's all have USB ports, or they have permanent cables attached to hook to the bike.

The only fail-proof method is to have the map on a piece of paper. Most tuners can read numbers and type. I'll go the antiquated paper printout method myself.

Chief

[Hoist!]

Well, its all up to you. the map files are tiny, about 5kb each. If I were going to carry an electronic copy with me, I'd opt for a cheap flash drive. This requires the person to have a USB port on their computer. This is almost a given for a laptop, but I don't know if the DJ-250's all have USB ports, or they have permanent cables attached to hook to the bike.

The only fail-proof method is to have the map on a piece of paper. Most tuners can read numbers and type. I'll go the antiquated paper printout method myself.

Chief

Thanks Chief! Hoist! 8-)

[ultrafxr]

Hoist, I think Chief is right.  I'd carry a paper printout of the map and an electronic copy either on a cd or flash drive.  You can always get a new pc overnighted to almost anywhere you might be, load your map and you're back in business.  I ran a pc on my '99 for 4 years with no problem but then it did fail due to improper routing of the cable which got chafed and rubbed through the bare wires.  The goofy signals sent to the ecm made it really crap out.  Since I had a stage II download I just ran it that way back home.

But that was not really a fault of the pc but some tech along the way who I think removed some cable ties securing the cable.  That was on the old mm fi system - the pc had to fit under the left sidecover 'cause the ecm on the right was so big they both couldn't fit there.  A pretty big cable then had to run from the pc to the ecm, hence the problem.  The new Delphi ecm is so small that the pc fits with it under the right side cover - no long cable.  Much, much cleaner install.  Doubt you'd ever have the type of problem I had.

[Hoist!]

Hoist, I think Chief is right.  I'd carry a paper printout of the map and an electronic copy either on a cd or flash drive.  You can always get a new pc overnighted to almost anywhere you might be, load your map and you're back in business.  I ran a pc on my '99 for 4 years with no problem but then it did fail due to improper routing of the cable which got chafed and rubbed through the bare wires.  The goofy signals sent to the ecm made it really crap out.  Since I had a stage II download I just ran it that way back home.

But that was not really a fault of the pc but some tech along the way who I think removed some cable ties securing the cable.  That was on the old mm fi system - the pc had to fit under the left sidecover 'cause the ecm on the right was so big they both couldn't fit there.  A pretty big cable then had to run from the pc to the ecm, hence the problem.  The new Delphi ecm is so small that the pc fits with it under the right side cover - no long cable.  Much, much cleaner install.  Doubt you'd ever have the type of problem I had.

Thanks for the report Jerry. I'm getting it installed and dyno'd next week, weather permitting. It was 10 deg this morning! I guess there were some unknown/unanswered questions I had. I feel pretty comfortable with this. These last things will just give a little peace of mind on the road! Hoist! 8-)

[ultrafxr]

Thanks for the report Jerry. I'm getting it installed and dyno'd next week, weather permitting. It was 10 deg this morning! I guess there were some unknown/unanswered questions I had. I feel pretty comfortable with this. These last things will just give a little peace of mind on the road! Hoist! 8-)

I'm still running bone stock at 1,500 miles.  No problem and I kinda like the quiteness of the stock muffs.  I saw GC's post about the Fullsac mod to the stock muffs and think I might give that a try along with the K&N filter I have that fits the stock air box and then add a pc.  But I'd really like to hear what the muffs sound like after the Fullsac mods.  Guess I'll have to keep chewing on this for a while.  Looking forward to see how you like the SPOs 'cause that is another possibility.

[Hoist!]

I'm still running bone stock at 1,500 miles.  No problem and I kinda like the quiteness of the stock muffs.  I saw GC's post about the Fullsac mod to the stock muffs and think I might give that a try along with the K&N filter I have that fits the stock air box and then add a pc.  But I'd really like to hear what the muffs sound like after the Fullsac mods.  Guess I'll have to keep chewing on this for a while.  Looking forward to see how you like the SPOs 'cause that is another possibility.

Thanks Jerry, I'm looking forward to the SPO and Doherty PP combo with the PC dyno'd for same. It should be an interesting package, that I haven't seen before! I'm using the S&S backplate for the PP that works with the '07 throttlebody and S&S Teardrop Cover! Pics will follow when I'm done! Hoist! 8-)

[DCFIREMANN]

Man this thread has taken off. I have read all of the replys and I am still kind of confused with the decisions people are thinking about making.

If you are worried about your warranty then I would do nothing. Give it time the heat will help you grenade the motor. Then you can see how fast your warranty works. It should work but how much time are you looking at. If it is riding season you may lose it all.

For me the SERT is not even an option and with the PC you are removing the O2 sensors. Not a bad thing. You are better with no sensors then a narrow band sensor IMHO. But you still need to pay for a dyno tune.

I still think the Thundermax with Auto Tune is the best choice. If you have a problem replace your stock ECM and sensors and take it back to the dealer. The thing everyone is overlooking. Zippers can and does build some of the fastest motors out there EVERYDAY. I have witnessed it live and in color. For the average street guy looking for just a little added punch and more reliability Zippers is the ONLY way to go. You will get a tested system that will last. If you are shopping price and looking for the cheapest way to go then my question is. WHY DID YOU EVEN BUY A CVO?? IMHO that is like being house poor. That big house looks good on the outside. You have laid down a lot of cash so why sacrifice? You can bet I will not. When they did my build I wasn't looking to be the fastest out there. If I was I would have a 120 inch motor pushing 170HP in my frame. They build these motors all day long. What I have is a proven combination that will last and is fun to drive. It has it all. Low throttle response. great TQ down low and when I twist the wick it has a lot on top end.

So it would be an easy choice for me. Thundermax.

Be Safe

THE DAWG

[HUBBARD]

DAWG,
  I agree wholeheartedly with you, Bro!  But looking back, I can remember back in my trial and error days, in my quest for more HP.  Being young, green, and somewhat naive, I acted on a lot of advice that was truly wrong, in more things than the pursuit of HP, I'm sorry to say.  It was only when I had had enough, and sought out the "Legends" in the making of HP, made it a point to become Friends with them, informed them of what I was looking for, and asked them, "How much?"  That's when I started running up front.  Our Engines are nothing but air pumps.  If the air-flow is restricted in the exhaust, as opposed to the intake, that breeds the enemy of performance and long engine life.  The brain-child of our illustrious EPA.  There endeth the lesson.  Later--HUBBARD