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[GRam]

Did the 117 cyls/jugs. ESP was paying labour, so decided what the heck. Results are mixed. Torque is great, but the HP is on a milk carton somewhere..
Details of build : HD 117 jugs/pistons, TMan 625 cams, HD MVA heads, decked to get compression up (203/205), HD 58mm TB with 5.3 injectors, PM air cleaner
that like a total noob, I never considered swapping out the backing plate to fit the bigger TB. That's been rectified, parts on order. V&H power duals head pipe and V&H
HO mufflers round it out.

Having rectified my short sightedness on the AC, how much benefit would I see with an exhaust change? I know some will say 2-1, others will say re-core your stock cans..
Any actual testing done? Getting tired of spending money on the bike, want to put a blower on the Merc now, but have to get the bike sorted first..

Any and all ideas welcome!

[Heatwave]

Did the 117 cyls/jugs. ESP was paying labour, so decided what the heck. Results are mixed. Torque is great, but the HP is on a milk carton somewhere..
Details of build : HD 117 jugs/pistons, TMan 625 cams, HD MVA heads, decked to get compression up (203/205), HD 58mm TB with 5.3 injectors, PM air cleaner
that like a total noob, I never considered swapping out the backing plate to fit the bigger TB. That's been rectified, parts on order. V&H power duals head pipe and V&H
HO mufflers round it out.

Having rectified my short sightedness on the AC, how much benefit would I see with an exhaust change? I know some will say 2-1, others will say re-core your stock cans..
Any actual testing done? Getting tired of spending money on the bike, want to put a blower on the Merc now, but have to get the bike sorted first..

Any and all ideas welcome!

What kinda power are you know making?

[GRam]

112/126. HP lays over starting at 4800...

[Heatwave]

112/126. HP lays over starting at 4800...

I'd guess its an exhaust issue. Get a D&D Fatcat and retune. My guess is low 120's hp and upper 120's tq.

[Road Dad]

Mine is 120 hp and 130 tq. V&H full system

[Fullsac Performance]

Can you post the dyno chart? Seeing the TQ curve would be helpfull.

SG

[GRam]

In all it's glory lol..

[Unbalanced]

Did the 117 cyls/jugs. ESP was paying labour, so decided what the heck. Results are mixed. Torque is great, but the HP is on a milk carton somewhere..
Details of build : HD 117 jugs/pistons, TMan 625 cams, HD MVA heads, decked to get compression up (203/205), HD 58mm TB with 5.3 injectors, PM air cleaner
that like a total noob, I never considered swapping out the backing plate to fit the bigger TB. That's been rectified, parts on order. V&H power duals head pipe and V&H
HO mufflers round it out.

Having rectified my short sightedness on the AC, how much benefit would I see with an exhaust change? I know some will say 2-1, others will say re-core your stock cans..
Any actual testing done? Getting tired of spending money on the bike, want to put a blower on the Merc now, but have to get the bike sorted first..

Any and all ideas welcome!

How was the compression done, was throttleblade open was the engine hot or cold, how long was the starter button or bypass held, were the compression releases turned off or disengaged if you used the starter button ?

Have you done a leak down test ?  If not, would be a good baseline to have.

The heavy breather is one of the best options for air cleaner and power if you don't have lowers that is.
The exhaust = The HO mufflers even on a 120 hurt my build quite a bit.   For the sake of saving dollars you might try and borrow a set of 2.25 cored fullsac mufflers to compare against the HO's.    HO's have a great sound but really hurt my initial numbers, hence I went with the drago 2-1.   Backing plate will allow more air flow.

Some of the MVA castings are Horrible.   I have 1 set that is pretty good and one set that is pretty bad.   Any picture or close ups of your chambers?

Once you get the air cleaner backing plate straight, you might rerun the WOT pulls and see if you note any changes, vs. tons of changes and no idea what fixed it or where you found the best changes.   Actually the heavy breather has a piece in the middle that comes out that brings it to 58.   Have you looked at that?

My guess is the Exhaust specifically the mufflers then combine it with restricting the airflow to the throttlebody and you have a pretty good cause of air starvation and lack of backpressure with the exhaust.

[FlaHeatWave]

Yep the HP is low, should be around 1HP/CI... The torque curve on that dyno sheet is a dog, not making 100 ft/lbs until 2600??
Doesn't even resemble a proper tq curve  for the 625s...

Thinkin' there might be other issues along with the HOs??

You're pissin' in the wind until you do a leakdown, and rule out any mechanical issues...

Everybody has told you that the HOs are not good... FullSac Baffles in the CVO cans or Kury Crushers are "go-to's" for a lot of folks, either work well with the PowerDuals

What about Tuner / Dyno guy?? Even though the AFR line looks ok, you could have tuning issues... Timing??  What did he have to say??

btw, the backing plate to 58mm is no big deal, definitely not the issue...

 

[hawgzilla]

Do you have the Power Cell or Power Dual?? Big difference-- both are mentioned here.  Dyno chart says power cell.

[GRam]

Put the stock heavy breather on last night, and yup, it mates up nicely to the 58. No biggie, was bored and thought why not?
Did compression test on a cold motor, pulled the fuse for the ACR's, pulled AC off, held throttle blade wide open, cranked the starter ten times. 203/205,
right where TMan says to be.
Sorry, no pics of the ports on the mVA heads (ONE of the problem areas I'm sure).
Be switching to the Drago's 2-1 over the winter. For the cost of buying the Fullsac baffles/wire wraps etc, and a new heat shield for my existing Power Duals (NOT power cells),
or a new head pipe that accepts my stock heat shield etc, I'm within $50 of the Dragula.

Tuning I think is handled competently. Timing tables etc adjusted, AFR is nice. Engine runs SO much smoother than it ever has after he got done with it.
Getting close to the end of the season here now, so I'll ride it as is, and tear into it over the winter.

First order of business is a leak down test, knock heads off and have them worked, most likely by Rick Ward, then put back together with my HPI 58 instead of the SE,
the new 2-1, and after that, run it til she blows!! 

Really thinking it all lays in the exhaust and heads, the two main influences for letting air in, and out...

[Fullsac Performance]

Put the stock heavy breather on last night, and yup, it mates up nicely to the 58. No biggie, was bored and thought why not?
Did compression test on a cold motor, pulled the fuse for the ACR's, pulled AC off, held throttle blade wide open, cranked the starter ten times. 203/205,
right where TMan says to be.
Sorry, no pics of the ports on the mVA heads (ONE of the problem areas I'm sure).
Be switching to the Drago's 2-1 over the winter. For the cost of buying the Fullsac baffles/wire wraps etc, and a new heat shield for my existing Power Duals (NOT power cells),
or a new head pipe that accepts my stock heat shield etc, I'm within $50 of the Dragula.

Tuning I think is handled competently. Timing tables etc adjusted, AFR is nice. Engine runs SO much smoother than it ever has after he got done with it.
Getting close to the end of the season here now, so I'll ride it as is, and tear into it over the winter.

First order of business is a leak down test, knock heads off and have them worked, most likely by Rick Ward, then put back together with my HPI 58 instead of the SE,
the new 2-1, and after that, run it til she blows!! 

Really thinking it all lays in the exhaust and heads, the two main influences for letting air in, and out...

GRam

Here' my Two cents. You don't need to spend any money to gain 10 HP.

The MVA heads and the 58 SE TB are not the problem The PM AC was killing you. The Heavy Breather is the best AC period. You reinstalled it, your already up 5-6 HP and TQ. The V+H HO mufflers are a problem, sell those to a friend you want to beat. Pick up a set of 2.0 Baffles for your stock CVO cans. With or with out screens and packing, there's no power difference. Keep the V+H Power Duals and shields. Its not as good as my DX Pipe on the bottom end, but its not hurting the peak numbers you are chasing. Retune and I think you should easily see more than 1 HP per cube.

SG

[FLSTFI Dave]

Listen to Steve.

Back in 09 I had a tuner prove to me just how much was lost with the V&H Hi-Outputs compared to fullsac 2.25 cores.  Enough that I sold me Hi-Outputs and got a fullsac system.  I have run the fullsac on every bike since, which was my 12, and 13 and my 15.  My wife's 11, and 13 had them and now her 15 does.

My 13 is built a bit, a 117.  I have lowers on my CVO King so I can not run the heavy breather.  A very good friend of mine and I have identical builds on the engine, he has the heavy breather.  He has 5 more torque and 3 more HP than me.  His torque curve is a little more curved due to he has a fuel moto head pipe and I have a Fullsac DX head pipe, which tends to produce a nice flat curve and comes on a little sooner.

Graphs of both builds are in this thread  http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=109187.0

[GRam]

Steve / Dave
Appreciate the responses! My issue is, my current V&H system is black, stock mufflers are chrome.. NOT mixing / matching that lol.
So called V&H to price out new heat shields, $595 for chrome heat shields, OR $599 for a whole new header pipe.
So add that $599 to the cost of cores / packing kit, and I'm more money than a Dragula setup. Or buy a new DX / FM etc head pipe, and same story.

The HPI I already bought years ago, so might be worth a shot, who knows. I guess what's better? A good 2-1? Or a 2-1-2? Looking at buying a full system either way now, it seems,
or just live with it (never did like the sound of this setup tho, tbh).