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[longlast]

I had all the intake body sensors out and cleaned when I was waiting for motor parts.
Because of stalling out coming down from cruising speed to a stop.
But the problem still exists after the motor build.

This morning I'm sitting looking at the bike 😗 thinking going on. Then remembering seeing the intake body butterfly being fully closed,( it's the only mechanical adjustment on the intake body.) A low idle adjustment scerw, was not sure what it was going to do, but at this point I'm game for trying anything . I removed the stage 1 intake breather assembly to access the adjuster then gave it about a little less than a 1/4 turn the butterfly opened maybe 0.02". Put it all back together started it up and there was no difference in the idle 
I went out to the HD dealership and it DIDN'T stall out once I even tried to make it stall by staying in high gear longer before shifting down and stopping.

Told the dealer what I did and why he thinks that maybe the ECM picked up on the adjustment and has corrected the stalling out coming down from cruising speed.

Coming home it didn't even attempt to cut out just right to idle about 950 rpm. Fingers crossed it's sorted

[iski]

Sounds like you found the problem & corrected it.   

[longlast]

Sounds like you found the problem & corrected it.   

I sure hope so, I've been told from a head performance shop, that maybe I should have it dino tuned that may find if there's any fuel map error and can be corrected.

I've not had it on a dino. Perhaps I should gift it done to see how the fuel air is behaving.

[iski]

I sure hope so, I've been told from a head performance shop, that maybe I should have it dino tuned that may find if there's any fuel map error and can be corrected.

I've not had it on a dino. Perhaps I should gift it done to see how the fuel air is behaving.

It could help, should not hurt.  All of my Harleys were tuned on a dyno, except this last one.  Have not had a reason to tune it.  On the others was for heat management/power.  Was always pleased with the results, took a couple of hours or so of dyno time to get them right.

[Twolanerider]

I sure hope so, I've been told from a head performance shop, that maybe I should have it dino tuned that may find if there's any fuel map error and can be corrected.

I've not had it on a dino. Perhaps I should gift it done to see how the fuel air is behaving.

...and then it will begin.  You'll learn it's a little "something" here and a little "something else" there. 

Before it goes on the dyno it will have been running quite satisfactorily.  Felt good.  No excess (unexpected) heat.  Fuel economy ok.  Then it will go on a dyno.  The gawdammed dyno. 

The dyno operator will show you pretty graphs with lines.  Lines!   Lines more confusing than the word "antidisestablishmentarianism."
 The lines will show that your previously-thought-to-be-running-just-fine motor was oh-so-close to being in ship shape and Bristol fashion; but (while oh so close) not quite.  Crap.

Then we buy a little of this and a tiny bit of that.  We pay the tuner to tune (not a piano or a fish).  Then we buy just a little more of something else.  Chasing those *(*^)(*&(* lines !!

Then, millions of dollars and hundreds of lives later and after having spent more time at the dyno than Bonnie Prince Charlie did in Scotland, we are done.  The lines, we are told, are "better."  And we're sure they are; because we spent all that money and time to make them that way.  Until on a ride home a few weeks and a couple of pints later we realize we honestly can't feel a damn bit of difference; but we never f'ing admit that.  To anyone...   


Not that I've ever done that chit.....

[Twolanerider]

It could help, should not hurt.  All of my Harleys were tuned on a dyno, except this last one.  Have not had a reason to tune it.  On the others was for heat management/power.  Was always pleased with the results, took a couple of hours or so of dyno time to get them right.

or that ^ 

[iski]

  Yeah, but those even curve lines and the numbers that might as well be hieroglyphics showed improvement in both lines and hieroglyphics.  Plus the tuner gets to treat his wife or girlfriend to a weekend away at a nice cottage.

[08glide]

don't forget, rackin' your bike out at 5k over & over.

[Yellow09SERG]

...and then it will begin.  You'll learn it's a little "something" here and a little "something else" there. 

Before it goes on the dyno it will have been running quite satisfactorily.  Felt good.  No excess (unexpected) heat.  Fuel economy ok.  Then it will go on a dyno.  The gawdammed dyno. 

The dyno operator will show you pretty graphs with lines.  Lines!   Lines more confusing than the word "antidisestablishmentarianism."
 The lines will show that your previously-thought-to-be-running-just-fine motor was oh-so-close to being in ship shape and Bristol fashion; but (while oh so close) not quite.  Crap.

Then we buy a little of this and a tiny bit of that.  We pay the tuner to tune (not a piano or a fish).  Then we buy just a little more of something else.  Chasing those *(*^)(*&(* lines !!

Then, millions of dollars and hundreds of lives later and after having spent more time at the dyno than Bonnie Prince Charlie did in Scotland, we are done.  The lines, we are told, are "better."  And we're sure they are; because we spent all that money and time to make them that way.  Until on a ride home a few weeks and a couple of pints later we realize we honestly can't feel a damn bit of difference; but we never f'ing admit that.  To anyone...   


Not that I've ever done that chit.....

Dang Don!!! I have never heard it said any better than that. I need to print that one and hand above my toolbox

[longlast]

...and then it will begin.  You'll learn it's a little "something" here and a little "something else" there. 

Before it goes on the dyno it will have been running quite satisfactorily.  Felt good.  No excess (unexpected) heat.  Fuel economy ok.  Then it will go on a dyno.  The gawdammed dyno. 

The dyno operator will show you pretty graphs with lines.  Lines!   Lines more confusing than the word "antidisestablishmentarianism."
 The lines will show that your previously-thought-to-be-running-just-fine motor was oh-so-close to being in ship shape and Bristol fashion; but (while oh so close) not quite.  Crap.

Then we buy a little of this and a tiny bit of that.  We pay the tuner to tune (not a piano or a fish).  Then we buy just a little more of something else.  Chasing those *(*^)(*&(* lines !!

Then, millions of dollars and hundreds of lives later and after having spent more time at the dyno than Bonnie Prince Charlie did in Scotland, we are done.  The lines, we are told, are "better."  And we're sure they are; because we spent all that money and time to make them that way.  Until on a ride home a few weeks and a couple of pints later we realize we honestly can't feel a damn bit of difference; but we never f'ing admit that.  To anyone...   


Not that I've ever done that chit.....

  Haha, good one.

I hear what you're saying.  I am OKAY on how it's running/has been running  as long as this stalling out  that I think I've resolved is resolved , it's still to early in the game to say for sure. I'll run it for the week to see if it is actually cured.

In the mean time, this is the e-mail  reply I got back from the head performance shop.  I'm not really understanding what the benefit I'd be getting out of it for sure other then like you mentioned have the peace of mind that it's been dinoed  and the back pocket being  lighter if it was not to cure the stalling issue.
He doesn't say if it would/could cure the stalling issue  He asked if I had a tuner on the bike, there's V&H fuelpak came with the bike.

E-mail:

   I'm afraid the Fuelpak is a very poor tuner. I don't work with
them and I don't know of any dyno that will either. I use nothing but
the Power Vision for tuning which is a much more powerful device. There
are others out there but none that have the capability of the Power
Vision. There are three options with the PV if you were interested.
Unless you're going to buy your own PV (over £500 and not really
necessary) you have to buy a license at £200 which would allow me to
'marry' my PV to your bike. I can then just download a map from
Dynojet's library which should work well but of course the map has not
been designed around your engine characteristics. I don't charge for
this. Alternatively you can have an auto tune which is an additional
£100 or a full dyno tune which is an additional £250. So you're looking
at either £200, £300 or £450. If the bike is standard without any engine
modifications then the map download would be better than what you have
now but the auto tune would work much better. The full dyno tune is far
superior but possibly overkill and overspending on a stock engine. Let
me know if I can be of any more help.

If I was to have anything done  which suggestion would I benefit from? 

[Twolanerider]

I'll be damned.  A dyno salesman that doesn't totally oversell.  He might actually be a tuner more than a salesman.

First thought isn't anything new.  If you're paying him to do the work use the tool he is familiar with.  TTS is a different tool but is as competent.  If the guy knows PowerVision, however, you're paying him so use that.  FuelPak is just a band-aid shot in the dark and not really a tuner at all.

Despite his recommendation I'd actually buy the PowerVision device.  But I'm a bit of a tech junkie and like being able to dink with things.  Having the unit will let you monitor engine parameters live, see and manage trouble codes and a few other things that you couldn't do yourself otherwise.  So if it didn't ding the pocketbook worse than the significant other would abide I'd buy the toy.

Once you've got it play with it some.  You might find yourself getting comfortable enough you can dial in a tune yourself.  You could certainly download and install a canned map yourself.  So the rest of the tuning costs you might actually avoid.  Worst case you've still got the interesting gadget / tool, it's yours, and sometime later you pay the guy for a little dyno time.

[longlast]

Cheers Don,

I've got some pro's and con's  to consider now. I'm not going to jump into this. My main concern is the stalling issue the bike has been running fine until the stalling  started some while back I don't even know if it's a tuning related issue  or a bad sensor (mind you there are no codes that come up when it's happened) so I guess that would mean the sensors are not reading a fault.  Again leading me back to fuel air starvation coming down off cruising speed that the ECM is not adjusting for. If my way of thinking is correct on how it works.

Now if the little manual adjustment on opening  the butterfly  I did has sorted it out I'll leave it at that.

[iski]

Hope your stalling fix continues to work, if it does no need to do anything further. 

Have a different take on it than Twolane, not to add confusion just another opinion.  Use the tuner your Pro tuner is most familiar with, in this case PowerVision. Not a fan of FuelPak or that type of tuner.

With PowerVision would take the £200 option.  Unless you are doing more engine modifications in the future, once your bike is tuned to the engine equipment it currently has, it will be tuned. You won't need the PowerVision again, unless you decide to change out cams, etc.  The canned map from DynoJet could make the bike run well enough to suit you, if possible would ride it after that map is added to check to see if it is running better, no backfires, etc.  Auto Tune for £100 more will be better than the tune you have now & is a better option than the canned map.  A full dyno tune for  £250 more will be the best tune, might be overkill but that will make the bike run at it's best performance level.

Or buy the tuner you like - TTS is a good option - and tune the bike yourself as Twolane suggested.  Know some who get good results doing this, know others who use this whose bikes do not run all that well but they are happy enough with it.

Whatever you decide, best of luck to you!   

Mike

[longlast]

Hope your stalling fix continues to work, if it does no need to do anything further. 

Have a different take on it than Twolane, not to add confusion just another opinion.  Use the tuner your Pro tuner is most familiar with, in this case PowerVision. Not a fan of FuelPak or that type of tuner.

With PowerVision would take the £200 option.  Unless you are doing more engine modifications in the future, once your bike is tuned to the engine equipment it currently has, it will be tuned. You won't need the PowerVision again, unless you decide to change out cams, etc.  The canned map from DynoJet could make the bike run well enough to suit you, if possible would ride it after that map is added to check to see if it is running better, no backfires, etc.  Auto Tune for £100 more will be better than the tune you have now & is a better option than the canned map.  A full dyno tune for  £250 more will be the best tune, might be overkill but that will make the bike run at it's best performance level.

Or buy the tuner you like - TTS is a good option - and tune the bike yourself as Twolane suggested.  Know some who get good results doing this, know others who use this whose bikes do not run all that well but they are happy enough with it.

Whatever you decide, best of luck to you!   

Mike

Thanks Mike, Cheers for the input 

I'll take that all into consideration.   The motor (as far as I can tell) runs well when I give it the throttle the motor jumps from the running  tone to a real noticeable  different tone level in the acceleration. It start on the button first time even when it stalls with the clutch lever in it starts up again straight away if I haven't come to a complete stop I don't need to.

I'll give it a week to see how it goes. 

[grc]

Cheers Don,

I've got some pro's and con's  to consider now. I'm not going to jump into this. My main concern is the stalling issue the bike has been running fine until the stalling  started some while back I don't even know if it's a tuning related issue  or a bad sensor (mind you there are no codes that come up when it's happened) so I guess that would mean the sensors are not reading a fault.  Again leading me back to fuel air starvation coming down off cruising speed that the ECM is not adjusting for. If my way of thinking is correct on how it works.

Now if the little manual adjustment on opening  the butterfly  I did has sorted it out I'll leave it at that.

I can never remember what model year bike you have, but I'm going to guess it's later than a 2007 and thus has the electronic throttle control type of throttle body.  The older TB's had a separate idle air control valve that could get lazy and cause what you described, but that changed with the ETC throttle bodies and now the electronics are supposed to adjust the throttle plate automatically to maintain idle.  Supposed to and actually reliably do are often mutually exclusive however.  And some of those throttle bodies have had issues with sloppy stepper motors and throttle plates/shafts. 

The throttle plate stop screw is rarely adjusted after the TB leaves the vendors plant, and last time I looked Harley doesn't even mention adjusting them or give a specification for an adjustment.  But if that tiny adjustment you made fixes the problem, it won't harm anything.  It's highly doubtful the adjustment changed by itself (the screw is usually secured with something like Loctite), so whatever really caused the issue may get worse over time and the problem may return.  Until then, I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Jerry