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[Smiler]

Riding around yesterday and wound up hitting a string of trafic lights. Not stuck in traffic, but going from red light to red light. Oil got to 258, and the motor was hot enough that I heard it ping a couple of times when starting off.

Shot the heads when I got home, and got 331 Front, and 382 rear. This backs up the other hottest temp I have seen on the rear head. The ride home should have given it a good bit of time to cool down some. I have not shot it sitting still at a light yet. I may need to try that one day.

My AFR's are set 13.0 at idle, 13.5 at 0% to 60%, 13.0 at 80% throttle and 12.5 at WOT. Theses are no where near the 14.6 that the factory uses, and its still getting pretty damn hot.

Temps were in the mid 80's and sunny.

Sorry to steal your Pinion thread Jerry, but DAWG brought up the heat issue, and I thought this may be appropriate.

Now, back to our regularly scheduled Pinion Talk......

Chief - what mods are you running with

[Chief]

Chief - what mods are you running with

Sorry for omitting that.

Rinehart TD's
PCIII USB
SE A/C

Amsoil 20W-50

[Chief]

Don't think so Terry.  Just got off phone with my dealer and he said bottom end is same as yours.

Jerry is correct. The stroke is the same on the 96, 103 and 110. The 96 uses the same bore as the 88 (3 3/4") while the 95 and 103 share the same bore(3 7/8"). The 110 uses a larger bore still (4.00").

While the stroke is the same on our engines, the parts are different.

[Smiler]

Sorry for omitting that.

Rinehart TD's
PCIII USB
SE A/C

Amsoil 20W-50

So your having problems even with AMSOIL!!

[Chief]

So your having problems even with AMSOIL!!

Well, I'm not having problems, it's just hot. I do think I'll be changing more often due to accelerated thermal breakdown. Geez, I sound like an oil commercial.


Fixed grammar

[Midnight Rider]

Don't think so Terry.  Just got off phone with my dealer and he said bottom end is same as yours.

I'm going to have to do a little research on that one...I swear I read an article in a bike rag describing the new engines as having different connecting rods (lighter/thinner), crank, and flywheel...and a shorter stroke, or maybe it was shorter pistons.    I think it was in an article about oil puking out of the breather and how that was supposed to be improved with the new engine design.

My oil temps can get as high as 240, but generally stay around 225 when it's hot outside...it was HOT here yesterday.

[Kpasa]

Questions for those more knowledgable than me.  With several members reporting 110 engine failures due to pinions out of tolerance it would be helpful to know the symptoms of this problem and be able to recognize it before a catastrophic engine failure.  What to look for - be alert to.  What is involved in checking this?  Do cams have to be removed?

I was lucky, my symptom was a sudden loss of oil pressure because of broken gear in oil pump.  It was when I made it to a dealer, that I first heard of the pinion being out of tolerance, which was remedied as part of the warranty with a replacement engine.  Whether it was the pinion's fault or the gear's fault - I do not know.    I hadn't reached the 3,500 mile mark when this happened, and certainly hope this would not happen again.   The new 110" rides identical to the old 110" - before the unsolicited mishap.   I will have the pinion checked again at the new engine's 1,000 mile maintenace interval. 

[ultrafxr]

I'm going to have to do a little research on that one...I swear I read an article in a bike rag describing the new engines as having different connecting rods (lighter/thinner), crank, and flywheel...and a shorter stroke, or maybe it was shorter pistons.    I think it was in an article about oil puking out of the breather and how that was supposed to be improved with the new engine design.

My oil temps can get as high as 240, but generally stay around 225 when it's hot outside...it was HOT here yesterday.

Be interested to read that if you can find it.

[copout221]

I was lucky, my symptom was a sudden loss of oil pressure because of broken gear in oil pump.  It was when I made it to a dealer, that I first heard of the pinion being out of tolerance, which was remedied as part of the warranty with a replacement engine.  Whether it was the pinion's fault or the gear's fault - I do not know.    I hadn't reached the 3,500 mile mark when this happened, and certainly hope this would not happen again.   The new 110" rides identical to the old 110" - before the unsolicited mishap.   I will have the pinion checked again at the new engine's 1,000 mile maintenace interval. 

Great idea BUT how much will that run us ?? We shoudn't have to pay for that, it should be picked up by the MOCO.  

KPASA, What did you dealer tell you about the warranty on the new motor? Is it another 2 years from the install date or are we getting screwed with the remainder of the standard warranty that started at the delivery date?

[ultrafxr]

I'm going to have to do a little research on that one...I swear I read an article in a bike rag describing the new engines as having different connecting rods (lighter/thinner), crank, and flywheel...and a shorter stroke, or maybe it was shorter pistons.    I think it was in an article about oil puking out of the breather and how that was supposed to be improved with the new engine design.
My oil temps can get as high as 240, but generally stay around 225 when it's hot outside...it was HOT here yesterday.

Mine just (@ 5k) started a little drooling, but no puke.  BTW I changed the engine oil yesterday after returning home and was diligent not to overfill like I did the first time out.  Put 3 qts, 10 oz, went for ride and upon return led dipstick said Hi Oil.  What's up with that.  Anyway, have a hand held little pump and I withdrew what I think is about 8-10 oz this morning and dead cold led dipstick has one bar showing.  I'll take it out and get it up to normal operating temp (well maybe ABOVE normal with these 110s) and see what it reads then.

[Midnight Rider]

Mine just (@ 5k) started a little drooling, but no puke.  BTW I changed the engine oil yesterday after returning home and was diligent not to overfill like I did the first time out.  Put 3 qts, 10 oz, went for ride and upon return led dipstick said Hi Oil.  What's up with that.  Anyway, have a hand held little pump and I withdrew what I think is about 8-10 oz this morning and dead cold led dipstick has one bar showing.  I'll take it out and get it up to normal operating temp (well maybe ABOVE normal with these 110s) and see what it reads then.

Jerry, I think there's a lot more oil that "hides" in these motors than we realize.  Mine quit puking after it got enough out (it never was really bad)...now, after a high speed run, I notice a bit of mist on the cam cover, but you have to look at it just right to see it.  To get a really accurate reading on my LED dipstick, I have to jack the Legends up to full height, let it sit for a couple of minutes, then take a reading.  It is now reading about 1/4 to 1/2 quart low, depending on temp and how long it sat.  With the drain plug on the left front of the motor, I just think there's a lot of oil still up in the heads, pump and plate, and on the other side of the sump.  It could easily be 1/2 quart or more, IMO.

I'll try and find that article, if my CRS syndrome doesn't kick in tonight.   if I find it, I'll try and scan it, if I can remember how to use that old flatbed I've got.

I'm 99% sure you've got a different bottom end (in parts) than the 103, particularly the rods.

[Chief]

I'm going to have to do a little research on that one...I swear I read an article in a bike rag describing the new engines as having different connecting rods (lighter/thinner), crank, and flywheel...and a shorter stroke, or maybe it was shorter pistons.    I think it was in an article about oil puking out of the breather and how that was supposed to be improved with the new engine design.

My oil temps can get as high as 240, but generally stay around 225 when it's hot outside...it was HOT here yesterday.

Terry, you are right, lighter everything and shorter pistons. All in the name of reduced weight of the rotating assembly. I think it was S/B who mentioned he saw the 110 pistons and was astonished that there was so little skirt.

The stroke is the same 4 3/8 of the 103. but with a shorter skirt, they can use a shorter connecting rod.

[Midnight Rider]

Terry, you are right, lighter everything and shorter pistons. All in the name of reduced weight of the rotating assembly. I think it was S/B who mentioned he saw the 110 pistons and was astonished that there was so little skirt.

The stroke is the same 4 3/8 of the 103. but with a shorter skirt, they can use a shorter connecting rod.

Gotcha...that all rings a bell with my sometimers disease    Lighter can be a good thing, if it's done right.  We haven't heard of any rods coming out the side of the motors, so that's a good thing, but this whole crank runout thing is worrisome.  It's enough to increase the pucker factor a bit when you're headed off into the wild blue yonder.  I guess there's really only two choices...pull it apart and check it yourself, or just ride it and hope you got one that doesn't have the problem.      Have you got the warranty that pays for the motel room, etc? 

[ultrafxr]

Jerry, I think there's a lot more oil that "hides" in these motors than we realize.  Mine quit puking after it got enough out (it never was really bad)...now, after a high speed run, I notice a bit of mist on the cam cover, but you have to look at it just right to see it.  To get a really accurate reading on my LED dipstick, I have to jack the Legends up to full height, let it sit for a couple of minutes, then take a reading.  It is now reading about 1/4 to 1/2 quart low, depending on temp and how long it sat.  With the drain plug on the left front of the motor, I just think there's a lot of oil still up in the heads, pump and plate, and on the other side of the sump.  It could easily be 1/2 quart or more, IMO.

I'll try and find that article, if my CRS syndrome doesn't kick in tonight.   if I find it, I'll try and scan it, if I can remember how to use that old flatbed I've got.

I'm 99% sure you've got a different bottom end (in parts) than the 103, particularly the rods.

I think you're right about the oil hiding.  Ditto on the cam cover, sometimes see a little there.  Where I really notice it is on the water bottle holsters that are on the rear guard rail in front of the saddlebag.  There'll be 4 or 5 drops of oil but when I pulled the cover and wiped it down there was very, very little in there.  Kinda like spilling a bottle of beer and you'd swear a whole keg hit the floor the way it spreads.

[ultrafxr]

Terry, you are right, lighter everything and shorter pistons. All in the name of reduced weight of the rotating assembly. I think it was S/B who mentioned he saw the 110 pistons and was astonished that there was so little skirt.

The stroke is the same 4 3/8 of the 103. but with a shorter skirt, they can use a shorter connecting rod.

Does that include the crank assy itself.  I can't see that lighter rods and pistons should have any affect on crank runout.