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[RedDevil]

Victory has 3500 pre-books for the new vision touring bike. Some of them have to be Harley riders.

I would think very few, if any would be Harley riders.  I would venture to guess that most of them are probably wing/beemer owners looking at a chance to get an American V-Twin...but isn't as traditional looking as an HD.
cheers ,
 

[SixGun]

I floated the question of trading my 07 Jester for a C6 on the Corvette forum and an HD wholesaler pm'd me saying he'd just picked one up last week...for 25K! 

That's what I'm talking about.  07's are going for under 30K easy on ebay.

That is why I'm not going to buy a new bike anymore, my truck didn't lose that much value the first year.

I'm so mad I could spit, I had hoped that I was getting something special in a CVO but I don't think that's the case anymore.

However, I am part of the problem because I paid MSRP+ myself exacerbating the whole situation.

You know what they say about screw me once!

[Rides2007Harley]

I am not trying to be a wise azz but why is it the dealers and MoCo fault that retail prices are not inflated like they once were?

Examples: When the PT Cruiser was introduced there was a waiting line and people paid over invoice, same thing with the new style Mustang and now you can pick up a PT for practially nothing.  Now it is the IPOD phone, demand is high and not long ago people were waiting in line for the new playstations.  These companies offered a product and people wanted to buy them.  It really is that simple.

Anybody that buys a new CVO or any Harley for an investment is making a terrible decision.  Enjoy it for what it is, a new motorcycle that is going to lose money as it ages but factor in the joy and fun you are having with it.

[PHAZE]

The only way to lose money on a bike is if you sell it.  Once you buy a bike, you just need to keep it.  It's taken me some time to come to this conclusion, but I keep trying to remind myself how wise it is to keep a great bike rather than going for the latest, greatest thing.  (Check back with me in a month or so and I might have a couple of great bikes for sale if the price is right!)

[Robmay]

When did we start buying our bikes as an "investment"? You guys are starting to sound like the Gold Wing riders!!

On the note of Moco and prices............. I guarantee you that if you are not "in line" with certain pricing, your "allocation" will be afftected the next year.

I know when I was looking at doing a retail hobby store once years ago you could NOT sell under a certain price in your area to protect other dealers. I'm sure this works in the same manner on a much larger scale.

[PHAZE]

I thought that "investment" was just one of those descriptions that you used when you were trying to sell your wife on a purchase - bikes, guns, tools, etc.  We wouldn't really try to use the term to describe a motorcycle purchase with other CVO owners would we?

[SixGun]

You're right, as long as people will pay the price they (dealers) should get all they can.  I was just hoping as a repeat customer that the dealer could have given a little leeway on the profit.  But if there is a line out the door for bikes then why would he.

A few years ago (five) when I was looking for subcontractors to do some work the building boom was ramping up.  I tried to get a few to do some small jobs for me, not a chance, they didn't want to fool with it.  I did mention to a few that times won't always be like this.  Well, fast forward, now with subdivisions full of unsold homes it seems the subs are calling me looking for work.  Sorry, only the faithful need apply.  If you turned me down in the past "you'll get nothing and like it" as it was stated in Caddy Shack.

As far as the investment comment; I never mentioned it.  I was just talking about a CVO being a "special" machine that hopefully would help keep it's resale value up.

However, as a percentage of resale value between a regular Ultra and my Jester, I think the CVO loses a higher percentage than a stock bike.  However, that was just a cursory look at ebay.

Oh well, it's been a stimulating discussion but I'm done...

[miker]

You're right, as long as people will pay the price they (dealers) should get all they can.  I was just hoping as a repeat customer that the dealer could have given a little leeway on the profit.  But if there is a line out the door for bikes then why would he.

A few years ago (five) when I was looking for subcontractors to do some work the building boom was ramping up.  I tried to get a few to do some small jobs for me, not a chance, they didn't want to fool with it.  I did mention to a few that times won't always be like this.  Well, fast forward, now with subdivisions full of unsold homes it seems the subs are calling me looking for work.  Sorry, only the faithful need apply.  If you turned me down in the past "you'll get nothing and like it" as it was stated in Caddy Shack.

As far as the investment comment; I never mentioned it.  I was just talking about a CVO being a "special" machine that hopefully would help keep it's resale value up.

However, as a percentage of resale value between a regular Ultra and my Jester, I think the CVO loses a higher percentage than a stock bike.  However, that was just a cursory look at ebay.

Oh well, it's been a stimulating discussion but I'm done...

Of all the nerve.....

[Robmay]

Sixgun, I meant no disrespect nor did I say that you said anything about "investment". My apologies if you were bothered. My defenition of an investment is indeed resale value and as that was what most were referring to............. anyway, no harm intended to anyone.

[skreminegul07]

No such thing as "dealer trades", but if one of the "Snow Locked" dealers wants to sell their inventory to other dealers, like say in Arizona, they can do so but still must register it which must be done within a certain number of days of sale (that dealer in Arizona becomes both the registered and legal owner of that new bike!).  The snow bound dealer (with not many sales in the dead of winter) records a sale with MOCO which helps maintain his "future" allocation new bike inventory volume.
The person in AZ who purchased that bike will be given a similar song and dance about a "preregistered" bike in his inventory.  The second selling dealer is actually selling a use vehicle (once registered it is considered used by most motor vehicle Dept's)
Bottom line is a dealer can't sell without registering the vehicle.  If someone could purchase for less than MSRP, they could always advertise and sell to someone to make a fast buck.  That first dealer is not giving much up when they sell to the dealer in Arizona.  That is why, when the demand was so high, the second dealer could ask for another $2,000 over MSRP and still make a profit.

The MSO (Manufacturer's Statement of Origin) is what the original selling dealer submits to DMV.  After that, the title is all that exists.  The original dealer could pass of the MSO to the next dealer but won't log a sale and may have his allocation from MOCO reduced.

Magic, there was an MSO on the bike.  The dealer did not want the bike with MSO to leave the dealership so it could be resold as new, that's it.  Now they will do that.

[SixGun]

RobMay...no drama, I've decided to keep my Jester until they produce a water cooled model.  However, I won't have to wait long with "CycleVisions" pumping out water cooled baggers already.  Big brother MOCO is gonna be all over that!

[Robmay]

RobMay...no drama, I've decided to keep my Jester until they produce a water cooled model.  However, I won't have to wait long with "CycleVisions" pumping out water cooled baggers already.  Big brother MOCO is gonna be all over that!

 ........... got a link to that??? 

[MJZ]

Here's a picture of the prototype:

[deucedog]

Today I contacted multiple dealers only in California to find a 2008 CVO Ultra Classic to back up the one deposit I have that is starting to appear sketchy.  The dealer thought it was an Ultra they had coming, but it turns out it will be a RK.  They are calling me tomorrow to clear this up.  So I went out hunting for the "back-up" bike.

What an incredible cross section of conversations I had with the dealerships!  Here are the highlight quips from the people I spoke to at various stores:

1. "Yeah, we can sell all we get at 5 over, and we get 2500 over on the regular ones, we use Brown's chrome from Kentucky on 'em"   

2. "We sell for MSRP, but we only get 5 of them and the waiting list is 20 deep, we're not taking any more names" 

3. "We get 3-5 over, but I'll ask my manager if he'll let the next one go at MSRP, but you gotta do something for me if I can get you that deal, like buy a 2 year extended warranty or something"   

4.  "Yes sir, we have a Silver/White and Anniversary coming at MSRP plus Freight and Set Up of $995 - that's it, would you like to leave a deposit?" (Send me a PM if you would like to contact this dealer, they were real) 

5. "We don't get many of them, and the ones we do get are spoken for" 

6. "We can't sell out of our area, but if it gets slow around here, you never know what they're willin' to do"   

7. "I got a regular Ultra, want that?" 

Anyway, seems like the only way to get a CVO Ultra in California at MSRP is to first find the "fair" (like retail of $35K wasn't enough) dealer an give them a deposit.  In California, all deposits are refundable, so the game appears to be to lay out a few depositis, sit back and wait for that call - the horse may sing!   I have 3 deposits and I disclosed and was up front with each dealer that I have deposits with the other dealers because you never know for sure if the bike will come in, sometime the delivery schedules get goofed up, so I did it to hedge.   The salesman at the "fair" and reasonable stores understood the multiple deposit syndrome.  I have tried in past years to get one of these CVO bikes and this year we're determined, they sure look nice.  We especially like the 105th Anniversary CVO Ultra.  It's a color you either love or hate.  We liked it and hope it comes in ...   

[magicl1]

Magic, there was an MSO on the bike.  The dealer did not want the bike with MSO to leave the dealership so it could be resold as new, that's it.  Now they will do that.

Guess it's a sign of the times.  MSO's generally got handed off between dealers.  But with HD's if they did not turn the MSO in to register a "sale" even, if it was to another dealer, they could not claim it towards their official "sales" with MOCO and thus could hurt future allotments.  Most people do not question the "titled" bike when it only has 7 miles on it.

There are still dealers in the AZ area that will try to get more than MSRP to see if someone will "bite the bait".  My dealer has always been MSRP and I have recently heard less than that for some of the slower moving items.
Deucedog's post covers most of the pitches I heard back in 2006.