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[Fullsac Performance]

Who the hell would believe a dealer over us anyway??

Hoist!

Not me!

Info from the dealer? 50% chance of accuracy. Maybe.

All right everybody! Break in is over! Pull the pipes! Who's got a cat stuffing things up? We need an accurate report with pictures.

SG

[Hoist!]

Not me!

Info from the dealer? 50% chance of accuracy. Maybe.

All right everybody! Break in is over! Pull the pipes! Who's got a cat stuffing things up? We need an accurate report with pictures.

SG

You know it Steve!!!

Hoist!

[Jim Kerr]

Guys, I believe you, not the dealers!  I'm just the messenger.  That's what he said.  I don't think he's bs'ing me.  They just haven't had 09 exhaust headers off yet.  There's nothing to replace them with. Slip-ons is about they have installed so far  

In lieu of pulling the entire exhaust, I figured I'd go to the trusty FLTRSE3 Parts Catalog and take a look.  Turns out that you guys are right on the money.  We all appear to have cats in the main header pipe where the two pipes are combined.  The part number is 66855-09 (Exhaust Pipe Assembly, catalytic (Domestic, Canada, California).  They also have a part listed for the International Models.  They, of course, also have cats (P/N: 66849-09 (Europe); 66855-09 (Japan).  Freaking moco! 

I scanned the exploded view and part numbers and am attaching it.  Hope you all can read it.

[grc]

Very interesting.  I had no idea all 110's had a cat from the beginning.  Wonder why the $200 California Emissions fee is for? 
Can you post a picture of what yours looks like and where it is?  I will be digging into my exhaust later this week.  I would like to find it so I can figure out what to do to get rid of it. 

FWIW, several people have sent their slip-on exhaust to Fullsac.  A cat isn't in the slip-on muffler.  When the baffle is removed you can see through the pipe with no obstructions. To your point, if it's there it would have to be in the cross-over section. 

The California bikes require both the catalyst and the evaporative emissions gear (carbon cannister), neither of which is on the 49 state versions of the standard bikes.  The Touring CVO's and the International models also get the catalyst, and you can bet it's figured into that fat MSRP instead of being called out separately like the California bikes. 

Jerry

[Jim Kerr]

What can we do with the cc?  It is integrated into the main header pipe.  Getting rid of it doesn't appear to be as easy as replacing the baffle.  Do we get someone to make a new one?   Can we drill out the cat in the existing header?  Do we have to live with it until true duels are released? 

[Fullsac Performance]

Good work Jim!
Harley may be thinking about legalities here? By putting the cat in the headpipe, the consumer is less likely to remove it by installing aftermarket mufflers looking for a little rumble. (not us)  Once again, the dealers can install SE 49 state legal mufflers with out breaking the law by removing the cataylic converters. Maybe?
I think the Moco has gone Green! Second thought, they have always been green. All about the cash! They are either saving money or planning on making money selling non cat SE mufflers.
Now that makes sense.

SG

[Jim Kerr]

Harley may be thinking about legalities here? By putting the cat in the headpipe, the consumer is less likely to remove it by installing aftermarket mufflers looking for a little rumble. (not us)  Once again, the dealers can install SE 49 state legal mufflers with out breaking the law by removing the cataylic converters. Maybe?
I think the Moco has gone Green! Second thought, they have always been green. All about the cash! They are either saving money or planning on making money selling non cat SE mufflers.
Now that makes sense.

Brilliant points Steve.  I never thought about it this way.  If a dealer knowingly installs an illegal pipe on a known street machine they could get nailed big time by the EPA.  Noise laws are locally governed, which end up amounting to a traffic ticket for the owner.  A waiver and disclaimer in a parts catalog is more than enough to transfer Noise related matters to the owner/operator.  Disclaimers, bankruptcy, etc. can't get the dealer or moco out of Federal regulatory matters.  Freaking EPA! 

This reminds me of when cc's came out for cars.  The after market world sold bypass pipes that owners could easily buy and install.  Commercial shops couldn't install them, but could work on a car if they were already there.  We can do the same here.  We need to find someone that can mass produce a head pipe with exactly the same specs as stock (excluding the cc).  Anyone releasing such a gadget would make serious $$.  It would probably fit every touring model (moco's smart about creating universal fit whenever practical).  From a legal perspective, the manufacture would not be liable from an EPA perspective either.  They are only making header pipes.  They are not installing or bypassing the cats.   

[Fullsac Performance]

Removing the stock cats may not be a big deal. A piece of rebar and a hammer usually works. As soon as I get my 09 I'll be dyno testing it stock and then doing a sequential build up testing every modification. You never know, removing the cats may only yield a few points or less on a stock bike. Either way, I will have a 2 into 1 system coming out first of the year. And I am definitely looking into a headpipe replacement that will work with the stock dual mufflers too. But only if it makes more power. If not why bother?

SG

[Talon]

Saw you 2-1 testing on youtube, nice burnout!! 

[Jim Kerr]

Steve, you are freaking awesome!  Your approach to this is systematic and logical. What you are doing will help all of us.  Thank you!

If you need someone that can try mods feel free to reach out to me anytime.  I'm happy to trial test beta parts, take photos, or pretty much help you in any way I can.   

Please keep us posted,

[Talon]

Steve, you are freaking awesome!  Your approach to this is systematic and logical. What you are doing will help all of us.  Thank you!

If you need someone that can try mods feel free to reach out to me anytime.  I'm happy to trial test beta parts, take photos, or pretty much help you in any way I can.   

Please keep us posted,

Here's the beta test! 

[Fullsac Performance]

Here's the beta test! 

Glad you guys find that video amusing.
By the way, the top end is miss is the 6200 RPM rev limiter kicking in.

Specs on that bike are
2007 96", stock pistons and crank.
Andrews 37 cam, GMR heads, 9.8-1 comp.
Stock TB, Ness AC,
One off pipe, 98 HP- 100TQ.

[Jim Kerr]

Glad you guys find that video amusing.

Steve, it must be a sign.  We have the same safety gear

[DakotaZeb]

Steve,

What is the price for a set of 1 3/4 inch baffles?

[Fullsac Performance]

Steve,

What is the price for a set of 1 3/4 inch baffles?

Retail Price is 119.00. CVO member less 10% = 107.10.
Thanks for your interest.

Steve