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[mvent]

Chased " lifter " noise on an 05 SE Fatboy, with a 113, Jims ,99B, HQ Black ops, different grade oils, dino and synth, recently installed a

[mvent]

Sorry bout that, recently installed  Wild Things cam, amazingly quiet.
FWIW
Mike

[HILLSIDECYCLE.COM]

Have had a chance to use the Wood lifters, on several occasions now, and they DO quiet things down.
Scott

[fatboybern]

yeah i dont beleive you need a lab or all that other fancy bs mentioned just good mechanical background its called trouble shooting im by no means a parts changer but there are ways things can be diagnosed this is not a rocket scienced engine boys this is a air cooled pushrod engine that has been around since the beginning of time I dont no that everyones noise is the exact cause as my noise but i do no that my friends 103 makes the exact same noise and from my past experience it sounds like lifters the valve train goes through and event while it is running that the pushrod becomes looser and you hear this tick every time the slack becomes taken up just a little time and patience and it can probably be resolved another felow on here said he had went to the woods lifters and it quietened the valve train up

[PattiB]

Does anyone have the part number and a good place to get the woods lifters for my 110? Thanks Roger

[Twolanerider]

Does anyone have the part number and a good place to get the woods lifters for my 110? Thanks Roger

http://www.woodcarbs.com/dirlifters.htm

[HD Street Performance]

Roger
I have them on the shelf
Don

[grc]

P/N:  WDL-1012  Directional Roller Lifters    MSRP  $260.00


Jerry

[Occam]

P/N:  WDL-1012  Directional Roller Lifters    MSRP  $260.00


Jerry

I like those, they seem monkey-proof. Just right for people like me.
I doubt I'd install a roller lifter 90 out, but 180....
Also like more oil to the top end. Might help quiet things down a bit.

[HmanTJ]

I too, have experienced the frustration with noisy lifters. I own a 2009 FLHTCUSE4, purchased 06/09. I understand the 110s deliver more noise than other engines. When I first made my purchase, I did not notice any noise that sounded abnormal. The first part of May, I took a 1300 mile solo road trip to Big Bend National Park. Between Sonora, TX and Fort Stockton, TX I was battling a terrible headwind. The posted speed limit on I-10 in that area is 80 mph. So, I am seeing 2800 to 3000 rpm. I began noticing an unusually loud noise in the engine. I had no apparent performance issues, although the headwind made that difficult to confirm. I made it to Fort Stockton, checked into a motel and called the dealership where I bought the bike. I've been doing business with this dealership for several years, but this is the first bike I have purchased from them (the reason is another story entirely). I described the noise I was hearing and the fact that I had battled the headwind for several hours to the Service Manager. For those of you unfamiliar with this part of Texas, Fort Stockton is about 300 miles from the nearest dealer. The SM offered the opinion that is sounds like it got a little hot. He asked the obvious questions regarding performance, oil pressure, mileage, etc., and suggested I let it sit overnight, fire it up in the morning and reassess. The next morning, at initial startup and idle, it sounded normal. However, once I got on the road and the oil had a chance to get good and hot, I heard what I would describe as noisy lifters. The noise was not loud enough to make me overly concerned, but they were noisier than usual. I elected to finish my trip and did so without mechanical incident. In the Big Bend area, cell phone coverage is out of the question. I feel it appropriate to insert here the best way I have found to describe that area. "I have traveled the road to the middle of nowhere and was fortunate enough to emerge from the other side." Anyway, back to the lifter experience. Once I made it back to the DFW Metroplex, I took the bike to the dealership. They listened to the noise and agreed that it was not normal to them either. We all agreed that the noise appeared to be coming from the front head in the top end. They tore it down and replaced all the lifters. Once I got it back, I noticed it still being louder than it was when I purchased the bike. I took it back to the dealership, let the SM and Tech listen to it again. We compared the noise to three other 110" engines going through the shop for various and unrelated issues. One was in for the 1k service, another for the 10k service. In listening to the noise comparing mine to the other 110s, there was not a significant difference. The SM got HD Tech Support on the phone. The Tech Support resolution was since there were no engine codes pointing to a problem, they felt there was nothing wrong and I should ride it. I agreed to continue to ride it until something occurred which pointed to a direct problem, but I wanted the SM to be thinking about one question I had. That question was, "Why am I now hearing this noise and it was never there before?" The following Sunday, I had the bike out for a local day trip. After about 50 miles I was disgusted with it and took it home and parked it in the garage. The next day (Monday), I had it right back at the dealership. The SM listened to it again and I reminded him that I was still looking for the answer to my question. "Why have I not heard this before now?" He agreed to have the Tech tear it down again to inspect everything to ensure nothing had occurred since they replaced the lifters. I got a call from the SM this past Thursday. He informed me that they had inspected the top end and everything looked normal. He instructed the Tech to tear it down further, even though he had no support from Harley or from his local management. What they found was that the flywheel was 12 thousandths out, causing scoring of the pistons, cylinder walls and cams. There was evidence this caused overheating by looking at the rings and cylinder walls. He said Harley is sending a new engine for them to install. In my opinion, the SM went above and beyond what is currently the standard for troubleshooting this problem. I feel he did this as a result of the relationship I have built with the dealership over the years. He had confidence in me that I knew my bike and that I was not trying to scam Harley out of something. My point is, you know your bike better than anyone! Build that relationship with the people at your local dealership. I have seen many posts referring to them as "stealerships". Based on what I've read on the posts, which is only one side of the story, I would have to agree. The dealership that has offered me what I feel is outstanding service is Texas Harley Davidson in Bedford, TX. They are a great group and they have earned my loyalty. Sorry for the long post and I hope someone gets something from it they can use.

[HD Street Performance]

You did nothing wrong, nor abused the bike.
The MOCO owes you a new motor, simple and plain as that. Fixing it will not be adequate using the OEM parts IMHO
That said you will end up with another hot runner and may have the same situation again.
FWIW just a cat gone, slight enrichment of the closed loop areas, a little more timing in the idle and cruise areas, and straight weight 50w oil would be a wise investment to prevent the reoccurance. Unfortunately that will be on you as the MOCO doesn't see anything wrong.
Air entrained in the oil is a cause of noise and lowers the net valve lift. On the exhaust side that causes them to heat badly.
The Woods lifters can help but are not the single source of the issue. All other ducks need to be in a row.

[Occam]

HmanTJ

You comported yourself in a patient and more than generous manner.
While I understand that the "dealership" has more than your scoot to worry about, I also feel that the MoCo as a whole should not continue to foist upon the public a product that features what can be charitably called "dramatically inferior" engineering. The host of heating, leaking and general part-to-part tolerance (QC) issues is long and storied.

I shouldn't have to constantly keep an ear on all sounds made by my scoot to compare them against my mental database to see if it is a new one, and a concern; I don't think that I should have to spend years and many tens of thousands in bike purchases (never mind the parts counter) for my friggin' "dealership" to trust ME. I have the money, they want my business. Consider also that while your SM was taking such good care of you, they had you riding yours while the pistons were scoring because it didn't throw a code. It took several visits, detracted from the enjoyment of your trip, and spent time torn down in the shop. Did your payments stop, or were you given a loaner?  Last but not least - and certainly not all - when you are buying the creme de la creme of HDs product line, it should be just that; not a regular model with its accompanying woes. More than paint and chrome, the QC and overall attention to detail should be higher to help provide a more pleasant ownership experience.

 

Sorry guys, I'm going through this whole valvetrain noise thing, and I'm getting the same resonse sent out by MoCo command central on how to put the burden on the purchaser, rather than own the problem and fix it. My schedule is frustratingly packed, and my ability to go drop my scoot at the shop frequently (only to be told it's actually ok) is nearly nonexistent. I'm just going to ride it until it scatters. I have a total of 4.5 years warrany remaining and will not sacrifice that with aftermarket parts. They're going to be buying me a lot of motors!
 

[HmanTJ]

Occam,

While I certainly understand your point of view, I can not, in good conscience, treat this piece of machinery any differently than I do any other. Just like any of my other vehicles, I am continuously alert for any unusual noises that may develop while I am using it. Although all R&D folks have good intentions, those responsible for the research and development of new and innovative ideas can not possibly create a lab-type atmosphere all situations I could possibly incur during the normal use of their product. As a consumer, I accept responsibility for monitoring the performance of the product and reporting issues which I feel are below my expectations or less than what the manufacturer represents at the time of purchase. Maybe I am mistaken, but air cooled technology is not exactly proven to be the best or most efficient technology on the market. Therefore, I monitor my motorcycle more closely. As I alluded earlier, I knew and accepted that fact and the accompanying responsibilities of ownership of such technology. Having enjoyed Harley Davidson motorcycles for over forty years, and this being the first engine I have ever had replaced, I also understand the value of personal schedules and I am also limited on the time available to hang out at the local dealership. While a "loaner" would be convenient for me, it was not promised or implied at the time of purchase, and I also knew and accepted that fact. Perhaps I should have purchased an automobile, which is accompanied with a more comprehensive warranty, but I have news for you. I just recently made the choice to end my ownership of one of the "creme de la cremes", as you put it, by disposing of a King Ranch Edition, Ford F-150. I owned the vehicle for 18 months and it was in the shop eight times for repairs. Of those eight shop visits, two were for more than one week each. Of those eight shop visits, not once was I offered a "loaner", even though I inquired. There again, Ford Motor Company did not "promise" me the use of a vehicle in the event mine was disabled and in need of repair. I made the purchase counting on it being a reliable vehicle, which I could enjoy with a reasonable expectation it would not be in Ford's Service Department. I do not expect Ford to produce every vehicle to run 300,000 miles without any mechanical failures. Perhaps I should! Does that mean all Fords are bad products? I think not! There are too many of them on the road for all of them to be bad products. When it came to the expectations I had of Ford Motor Company and the dealership where I made the purchase, they came up short. I discussed my displeasure with Ford and with the dealership and they chose not to try to meet my expectations. Consequently, I exercised my right not to own a Ford. Perhaps you should also exercise your right not to own a Harley Davidson as it sounds as if they are failing miserably to meet your expectations. I was aware of all the "MoCo" and "stealership" hype out there before I ever handed over my money. And, I'll bet you were aware of it also. So, neither one of us made our purchase blindly. And, prior to my purchase, I was aware of how difficult it can be to get Harley engaged to the point of being consumer friendly. All I am suggesting is that I feel I met my ownership responsibilities, Harley met all of theirs. It was the dealership that went beyond by investigating further. For that I am very appreciative. All things considered, you can rest assured that the minute Harley Davidson fails to meet my expectations as a consumer, I will be riding something else. When HD fails to meet the expectations of the majority, they will either change or go out of business. In the meantime, I will continue to enjoy my Harley. And, I will definitely continue with my responsibility of monitoring its performance just as do most all the members of this site.

[SBB]

All I am suggesting is that I feel I met my ownership responsibilities,
 Harley met all of theirs.

Harley met all of theirs? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??

                                                            

If you think Harley met all of their responsibilty then you are a PERFECT customer for a company that doesn't give a crap about their customers.
I suggest you read more of the post here that will clearly show how little the Motor Company cares about their customers.

Good luck, your going to need it.

SBB

 

[Occam]

Occam,

While I certainly understand your point of view, I can not, in good conscience, treat this piece of machinery any differently than I do any other. Just like any of my other vehicles, I am continuously alert for any unusual noises that may develop while I am using it. Although all R&D folks have good intentions, those responsible for the research and development of new and innovative ideas can not possibly create a lab-type atmosphere all situations I could possibly incur during the normal use of their product. As a consumer, I accept responsibility for monitoring the performance of the product and reporting issues which I feel are below my expectations or less than what the manufacturer represents at the time of purchase. Maybe I am mistaken, but air cooled technology is not exactly proven to be the best or most efficient technology on the market. Therefore, I monitor my motorcycle more closely. As I alluded earlier, I knew and accepted that fact and the accompanying responsibilities of ownership of such technology. Having enjoyed Harley Davidson motorcycles for over forty years, and this being the first engine I have ever had replaced, I also understand the value of personal schedules and I am also limited on the time available to hang out at the local dealership. While a "loaner" would be convenient for me, it was not promised or implied at the time of purchase, and I also knew and accepted that fact. Perhaps I should have purchased an automobile, which is accompanied with a more comprehensive warranty, but I have news for you. I just recently made the choice to end my ownership of one of the "creme de la cremes", as you put it, by disposing of a King Ranch Edition, Ford F-150. I owned the vehicle for 18 months and it was in the shop eight times for repairs. Of those eight shop visits, two were for more than one week each. Of those eight shop visits, not once was I offered a "loaner", even though I inquired. There again, Ford Motor Company did not "promise" me the use of a vehicle in the event mine was disabled and in need of repair. I made the purchase counting on it being a reliable vehicle, which I could enjoy with a reasonable expectation it would not be in Ford's Service Department. I do not expect Ford to produce every vehicle to run 300,000 miles without any mechanical failures. Perhaps I should! Does that mean all Fords are bad products? I think not! There are too many of them on the road for all of them to be bad products. When it came to the expectations I had of Ford Motor Company and the dealership where I made the purchase, they came up short. I discussed my displeasure with Ford and with the dealership and they chose not to try to meet my expectations. Consequently, I exercised my right not to own a Ford. Perhaps you should also exercise your right not to own a Harley Davidson as it sounds as if they are failing miserably to meet your expectations. I was aware of all the "MoCo" and "stealership" hype out there before I ever handed over my money. And, I'll bet you were aware of it also. So, neither one of us made our purchase blindly. And, prior to my purchase, I was aware of how difficult it can be to get Harley engaged to the point of being consumer friendly. All I am suggesting is that I feel I met my ownership responsibilities, Harley met all of theirs. It was the dealership that went beyond by investigating further. For that I am very appreciative. All things considered, you can rest assured that the minute Harley Davidson fails to meet my expectations as a consumer, I will be riding something else. When HD fails to meet the expectations of the majority, they will either change or go out of business. In the meantime, I will continue to enjoy my Harley. And, I will definitely continue with my responsibility of monitoring its performance just as do most all the members of this site.

I did not wish to be contrarian, it just happens that as I go out my garage to verify some of the work that was part of the 1k done at "the place I bought mine", I was a little heated from having to hold hands and double check them - as the SM requested over the phone. I did not mean to vent on you or your report, and I am ordinarily not such an obtuse fellow. Without getting into a battle and sour grapes here, let's leave it as an agreement to disagree, so long as other members are not led into a false sense of security. I had predicted that there would be presented to me the options to explore other brands (which I had already done), and allusions to traditional vehicles.
Let's let the dead horse lie where it is, and wish me luck!
I am taking my computer to the garage to TTS my wildly lean MoCo AFR right now.

     
Keep it shiny side up!