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[Unbalanced]

Here is an example of the dip ... showing right where you would want the power.

Glad you other guys dont have it,

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=6375.msg339286#msg339286

[sadunbar]

Here is an example of the dip ... showing right where you would want the power.

Glad you other guys dont have it,

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=6375.msg339286#msg339286

When John Golden did my tune, I asked him about a "dip" with the Fat Cat pipe....  He chuckled, then smiled and said "No, there won't be a dip......" 

There wasn't one....   

[Unbalanced]

Scott,

As I said earlier glad you dont have it, but go to google and search for the following.

"D&D Fatcat dip" 

[sadunbar]

Scott,

As I said earlier glad you dont have it, but go to google and search for the following.

"D&D Fatcat dip" 

I've seen plenty of dyno sheets with the dip (using Fat Cats)...  Just saying that I have also seen a few without the dip....  John Golden did both Twolane's and mine without the dip...

[DCFIREMANN]

Wow a bunch to post here on this one.

The fat kat does not have a dip. If it does there is a problem somewhere else. The THUNDER HEADER does have the inherent dip and it can be worked out. With a peice of hardware and tuning. For a 103 I would be running a thunder header. The 103 on the limited has stock 96 heads. A very good head to work with but not a good head for the Zippers 575 cams. The 575 cam was built for the CVO 103 back in the early days. They do use it on the 110's with success. The problem is with the HEMI HEAD design of the CVO heads. The 575 has early opening and closing events to cause an increase in compression, hence the big jump in TQ. It is a very good cam but I would not use it in the 103 Limited. There are some very good choices out there.

If you are on a tight budget a good air cleaner, exhaust and fuel managment programer with a proper tune will give you some very nice numbers. I think it will give you some numbers close to what you had with your 110. IMHO the 110's are over rated. At least in my neighbor hood!!!!!!

Be Safe

THE DAWG

[Unbalanced]

Dawg,

There must be a problem somewhere else on a ton of other builds then.     Guess your buddies at Zippers have issues with the dip huh.


I didnt post it originally but you can find the post here.
http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=10343.msg487326#msg487326

[Twolanerider]

Here is an example of the dip ... showing right where you would want the power.

Glad you other guys dont have it,

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=6375.msg339286#msg339286

As others have illustrated the FatCats themselves don't necessitate a dip.  Just because you've been told its true doesn't make it so.  Too many cases of just a pipe swap happening that didn't bring a dip in the process when there was none to begin with.

That doesn't say that someone's combination with the pipes might be an overall poor combination.  Or that a poor tuning effort didn't induce it.  But in and of themselves those pipes don't buy you a dip nor do they cause one.  The data set is too large and well known.  Finding different ways to suggest the same thing may be cute and self fulfilling.  But it's still sophistic.

[Twolanerider]

Dawg,

There must be a problem somewhere else on a ton of other builds then.     Guess your buddies at Zippers have issues with the dip huh.

And suggesting that Zippers themselves might not be quite the nuts is no great revelation either.  It still doesn't isolate the tuning effort from the pipes.

[SBB]

Just because you've been told its true doesn't make it so. 

As always, Don has nailed it again!

SBB

[Unbalanced]

Yup Don, I guess the flat spots in most dynos or dips around 3500 dont indicate it, just means a good tuner tuned out the majority of the dip.   Seems kind of ironic you dont see those pipes climbing there in that range doesnt it.  Guess it was plausible yet fallacious now wasnt it.

[HOGMIKE]

I have a 2007 ultra classic w a 110 conversion,251 cams 10.5 pistons runs at 100hp and 110ft/lb.
I'm looking at trading it in on a new ultra limited. What is the deal with the factory 103's? how much compression and so on. Can you get respectable power with just cams or do you need pistons heads ect.
I'm not looking for huge numbers just a decent running bike. If anybody can give me some ideas it would be greatly appreciated!

Think of what you expect to use this bike for.
The basically "stock" 103 bike works pretty well for long rides, two up, quietly, with no real surprises.
Once you change cams, heads, etc you start into that area of chasing horsepower, and we all know that THAT never ends! LOL
Before dumping a bunch of $$$ into a new 103, think of buying a little older bike and building the HP you can have fun with.
On the other hand, if you want 120/120 out of your new 103, go for it! Just remember your day to day "manners" will take a hit, but, the "fun factor" will be huge!
JMHO
 

[GC_Super]

I really haven't kept up with the technology of the new bikes, but if a guys on a budget and wants to keep the mods to a minumum, isn't there a gearing change available for the newer bikes ? Seems like I saw something indicating the trike had lower gearing.  I had my 06 changed to 337 before I ever picked it up along with the usual pipes/breather/tune etc and have been very happy. Have switched bikes with friends 103 w/o the gearing change and it makes quite a difference in "feel" as the power comes in a lot sooner for not much $$$$ .

[grc]

I really haven't kept up with the technology of the new bikes, but if a guys on a budget and wants to keep the mods to a minumum, isn't there a gearing change available for the newer bikes ? Seems like I saw something indicating the trike had lower gearing.  I had my 06 changed to 337 before I ever picked it up along with the usual pipes/breather/tune etc and have been very happy. Have switched bikes with friends 103 w/o the gearing change and it makes quite a difference in "feel" as the power comes in a lot sooner for not much $$$$ .

This is an often overlooked solution, probably because it isn't as "sexy" as cams, high compression pistons, ported/polished heads, and huge throttlebodies.  With our older bikes, it was very simple and relatively inexpensive to just change the primary ratio with readily available Harley parts.  Unfortunately, with the '07 and later model primary system there is no alternative crankshaft gear that retains the compensator feature.  There are alternative transmission output sprockets available from folks like Andrews and Baker, but that entails more expense for labor, a new belt, and speedometer correction.

A good Stage I setup, tune, and a gearing change also has the added benefit of being less likely to adversely affect reliability, as compared to the sexier stuff. 


Jerry

[HD Street Performance]

Who cares about sexy
Change the gears!
Mine were done right when Baker released the 30t front pulley. Made my 6th so much more useable. With performance mods nothing wrong with changing the rear also then a belt change is not required.
Here is a FatCat bagger (the only alleged dip offender by the internet), my heads 1.94" intake 1.575 exhaust, 113" 10.5/1
This build had 20K on it when tested and has since gone higher as the timing was not right (false ion sensing). we will test it again and I expect at least 5/5 more.