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[greglyon]

This is probably a topic that has already been discussed so I apologize in advance.  If not, I would like to see a forum where the membership can share safety tips, equipment, near misses, accidents that could have been avoided,  problem roadways etc.  Although safety is touched upon here and there in other forums, I think it is important enough to be given it's own forum.
I think discussion or a healthy debate would raise our collective awareness of safety issues and also help newbies get some practical advise beyond the MSF course.  What do you think?

[Garznhogs]

IROAR, ya got my vote  [smiley=thumbsup.gif]; even a 'sticky' maybe.  I'll start:
   [size=12]"Ride like yer invisible"[/size].

Garz  [smiley=smoking.gif]

[SPIDERMAN]

Ok,
    Here's my contribution. Given my track record last year (05) whatever I do, do the opposite and you should be good  [smiley=nixweiss.gif]

[greglyon]

Remember back when we took the MSF course or the equivalent.  They preached to us that most accidents were preventable.  We were taught techniques to lessen our chances of being a statistic.  Well over the years  we forget and sometimes get complacent while enjoying our rides.

I would like to see a forum  where people who have gone down or those who know the facts  put it out there for  us to dissect, debate etc until the  lesson is reinforced.

Also,  we can discuss headlight modulators, pulsing taillights, helmets, and other riding gear intended to make our  sport safer.  

We may not be the FAA when it comes to accident investigation, but we could still learn from the misstakes of others who are willing to share their experiences.  Although talking about an accident is a downer being in one  has got to suck!

[arcticdude]

I've been riding now for about 25 years on the street.  In my humble experience, I've found just the opposite of the "Ride like you're invisible" works best.  You need to ride like you own the road- to an extent.  The more "out there" you are, the more visible you become.  Yes, there is a point at where you become "another f$&%^@n biker" and an opportunity for some stupid cager to run you down; but those people are much fewer than the ones that simply don't see a motorcycle.  Safety/reflective clothes and such won't necessarily be the ticket either.  Point in case, in the 80's when I was in the military they started requiring you to wear "bright clothing" and most of us wore the standard orange safety vests.  I'd been riding for about 5 years at the time.  For some reason I had not had a close call to that time.  The first week I had that stupid vest on, I had a car pull out in front of me.  Mind you, I'm was riding a large bike (much like a Road Glide) with a bright orange vest.  The only other really close call I've had was in Europe where I had  truck pull over on me.  I was running about 150mph and he was doing about 65mph.  He just never saw me.  When I went by, the truck jumped about 2 feet back, must have scared the crap out of him.  But my point is, ride like you belong there.  Don't be afraid to "take charge".  But be ready for the moron that still doesn't see you.  When the wife and I ride, usually she's the one that gets cut off.  The cage's see me, but not her.  On a bright blue SERG, no less.  If you want to call it dumb luck, so be it, but it works for me.  I've done the experienced course twice now.  It's definitely worth doing.  Every instructor has a different approach so you'll learn something new each time.  If nothing else, you'll feel more comfortable on whatever you're riding.

[Garznhogs]

I've been riding now for about 25 years on the street.  In my humble experience, I've found just the opposite of the "Ride like you're invisible" works best.  You need to ride like you own the road- to an extent.  The more "out there" you are, the more visible you become.  Yes, there is a point at where you become "another f$&%^@n biker" and an opportunity for some stupid cager to run you down; [highlight]but those people are much fewer than the ones that simply don't see a motorcycle.[/highlight]  Safety/reflective clothes and such won't necessarily be the ticket either.  Point in case, in the 80's when I was in the military they started requiring you to wear "bright clothing" and most of us wore the standard orange safety vests.  I'd been riding for about 5 years at the time.  For some reason I had not had a close call to that time.  The first week I had that stupid vest on, I had a car pull out in front of me.  Mind you, I'm was riding a large bike (much like a Road Glide) with a bright orange vest.  The only other really close call I've had was in Europe where I had  truck pull over on me.  I was running about 150mph and he was doing about 65mph.  He just never saw me.  When I went by, the truck jumped about 2 feet back, must have scared the crap out of him.  But my point is, ride like you belong there.  Don't be afraid to "take charge".  [highlight]But be ready for the moron that still doesn't see you. [/highlight] When the wife and I ride, usually she's the one that gets cut off.  The cage's see me, but not her.  On a bright blue SERG, no less.  If you want to call it dumb luck, so be it, but it works for me.  I've done the experienced course twice now.  It's definitely worth doing.  Every instructor has a different approach so you'll learn something new each time.  If nothing else, you'll feel more comfortable on whatever you're riding.

Arcticdude, in essence you're saying what I meant... I always ride as if the other guy doesn't see me, then I'm not surprised that he doesn't. Happens lots o' times, and I don't even get excited anymore. Sorta like "Yeah, I knew you'd do somthing stupid, Azzhole."   So, I'm glad we agree!  

When you ride with your wifey, who leads...you, or her?  Of two bikes, is it the first bike that isn't seen, or the second?
I mostly let my wife lead (she knows the best way to get there anyway ) She rides at her comfort level (quite good, actually; she's a road captain in our HOG club, not to mention the Director of it  8-))  At times maybe I'd like to go faster, take off harder, corner harder, but that's okay, she's no slouch... and I can always goharderfaster when I'm by myself.  I'll do anything to keep her from danger or harm.

When we come to an intersection or other crossing involving another vehicle, I move around in my part of my lane, weaving or whatever it takes to break up the hypnotic trance of the opposing vehicle.  Just some odd, unexpected behavior that the opponent subconsciously registers and maybe makes 'em take a second look, by which time we're past (hopefully).

We've been considering modulating headlights for both bikes.  We ride with all 3 front bulbs on. She's got the saddlebag spoiler lights on her RK and I'm gonna get 'em for the seeg. Plus, considering other rear lighting. Gotta love them LEDs!   Had 'em on my RK and made my azz real visible.

Garz [smiley=smoking.gif]

[arcticdude]

I'm always in the lead in my "pack".  She never wants to lead.  I see what you were saying now about riding like yer invisible- always assume you are to the cages!  I agree 100%.  I'll also agree with the rear lights.  We've got them in the works as we speak for her SERG, having to have them painted to match; and I have them ordered for my CUSE.  I had all the LED's on the old Ultra, made a huge difference in the rear visibility.  Take a look at www.radiantz.com, good products and good people to work with.  I've got the 1' strip on the back of mine currently.  Adds alot to the rear.  I have upgraded bulbs in the spots, they work well too.  Does your SEEG take the 9006's or does it take the sealed beam for your spots?  The sealed beam upgrades from Custom Chome work GREAT!!  The upgraded 9006's are only fair, though I haven't taken time to aim them yet.  So they may get better.  The sealed beams, I'm not sure it mattered if they were aimed!  Ride On!

[ultrafxr]

I'm very active in my local HOG Chapter - over the years been activities officer, director, treasurer and a road capt for many years.  Also, MSF instructor.  Our chapter is very safety conscious.  We require our road captains to have completed the ERC within the past two years. Also, our dealer is very supportive and we have several HOG chapter members only ERCs throughout the year.  Cost is $75 and national HOG sends you a $50 certificate after completion which you can use at any Harley dealer. Our dealer also gives his own $25 certificate so cost to members is a net zero.  Hard to beat that deal and many, many of our members have completed the course.  You can definitely tell who has and has not completed the course by observing their riding habits and stlye.  If you've never taken an MSF course I strongly suggest you do so.  Even the beginner course is great since it is really about risk management and riding strategy.  I guarantee that you'll learn something no matter how long you've been riding.

[SPIDERMAN]

OK, Going with the idea that others can learn from my mistakes.

Accident # 1 6/20/05 Cobourg Ontario Canada Highway 401 6 PM
 Rear tire blow out at 70 mph.

Damage : One totaled 2003 SERK. One badly road rashed body. No head injuries, no broken bones. Found out later I had an undiagnosed concussion.

Recommendations : Check your tires every gas stop. Insurance company hired an independant lab and their finding was the tire had been cut along it's entire perimiter and then ridden some distance before the blowout. Did it happen between my last gas stop and the blow out or before the gas stop? I don't know, but I check my tires all the time.


Accident #2 10/25/05 Abeline Texas I-20 10 AM
Cut off by Indian Nationals in Gray Dodge Caravan They didn't stop.(stinkin sheetheads)  Riding in the rain, Tractor/trailer pulling out onto highway from access road .Minivan behind it. I pulled into the left lane to allow truck onto highway. Minivan shot out around truck into my path leaving me no way to go but the ditch. Almost made the median before going down, clipped the bottom corner of my right side saddle bag. Bike buried itself in the mud. I did the slide for life down the wet grass.
 
Damage :$1,000 damage to bike. Engine guard, saddlebag, mirror.One set of rain gear. $150. No injuries.

Recommendation : Scrap all minivans, shoot all sheetheads. Seriously, I was riding along at 55 mph. Given the road and weather conditions, maybe I should have either been riding slower or pulled over for awhile and sat out the rain.

[Garznhogs]

Leader of the pack. Make a good song title.  [smiley=huepfenlol2.gif]

I'll check out radiantz and Custom Chrome for lights...thanks.  

Don't know right off hand which bulb the spots are, other than weak. I want to change to the HD spot that has a replaceable halogen bulb, since that's what I had on the RK and I have a handful of spares.  

I'm adding the HD twin bulb headlight, same as wife's. Not the HID, but works fantastic.

Garz

[greglyon]

Spiderman, thanks for sharing.  I don't know what it is about mini-vans  that attract the absolute worst drivers, but that has been my experience as well.  We even comment about it when we ride.

I have been using headlight modulators for the last 4 years.  I bought them at www.kisantech.com Easy to install and very reliable.  Highly recommend.  I am sure we could work out a discount as well as he accomodated my HOG chapter.  

[SPIDERMAN]

 [highlight]I don't know what it is about mini-vans  that attract the absolute worst drivers, but that has been my experience as well.  We even comment about it when we ride.
 [/highlight]

IROAR
           People who drive minivans have an inferiority complex due to the fact they are driving the ugliest pieces of chit on the road. A minivan is the automotive equivalent of sweat pants. They compensate by driving like complete assholes and ignoring every rule of the road or courtesy there is as well as most of the laws.

[110tHunDer]

IROAR
           People who drive minivans have an inferiority complex due to the fact they are driving the ugliest pieces of chit on the road. A minivan is the automotive equivalent of sweat pants. They compensate by driving like complete assholes and ignoring every rule of the road or courtesy there is as well as most of the laws.

Gee, I trust no one on here owns a minivan?!? [smiley=nervous.gif] :-/ [smiley=nixweiss.gif]

[skyglide]

What is it with these minivan drivers?  They all should have a amber flashing light on top. Had so many close calls with these idots!

[SPIDERMAN]

Gee, I trust no one on here owns a minivan?!? [smiley=nervous.gif] :-/ [smiley=nixweiss.gif]

Well if they do, then that's their cross to bear.

I stand by my opinion and I think I've got company