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[willyB]

Having worked for a Steel cabinet manufacturer for 30 years how also does powder coating I can tell you that if you don't properly etch the S.S. Before powder coating the stuff will flake off.

Not really sure why but I've seen it a zillion times. We quit doing it even a customer demands it.

[joe_lyons50023]

I don't think there is anything wrong with the pipe itself but I have seen the coating flake off just like the two pictures posted. Crap, there's still some of the coating flakes under my lift.

Was said, before it was removed, the coating has to be...  "very high quality and durable, the integrity of the coating can be affected by many factors including the tune, installation, even the break in procedure specified for the coating, however like any finish the coatings are not completely indestructible for every possible scenario."


....So, could someone teach me how to break in a coated head pipe please? I've installed dozens and dozens and have never had a problem. Just thinking about this... "tune could be a factor" but don't people who have a FM head pipe normally have their tune by FM with one of those calibration files they send out? Lastly, installation an issue? Hummmm... well, if you say so but I truly don't quite agree with that statement either.

Anyway. I don't have a FM pipe so I don't have a dog in this fight. I have a Fullsac and the coating seems to be just fine even after having mine installed on two bikes since 2009 when Fullsac invented the collector design. I would bet a shiny dime that most of the head pipes installed by members on this forum are Fullsac.


OK, again... could someone please teach me the break in procedure when installing a coated pipe. Thanks

Use google,  it will help your life out a lot. http://boneheadperformance.com/ceramic-coating/ceramic-coating-break-in-procedure/  this was the first item that popped up.  Was there a big performance gain going from the fuelmoto headpipe to the fullsac or even a heat difference?  I doubt it, I guess it just depends on who's website you wana click on.  V&H, BuB, rb racing,ect. have a procedure for their coated pipes also but you being a decorated technician would know that right?

[Mr. Wizard]

I'm sorry... could you spell that for me again. Gooooogle was it?

Ghezzz. Ask an easy question and get a website tossed at your face and say find out yourself. I thought chat websites were for sharing information not telling someone to go fish.

Technician? Who me??     Take another look wise guy. Where did I say anything about any comparison about anything to do with performance? The conversation was about coatings and who's fell of. I have first hand knowledge of the pipes that "were in discussion here".

GheeeWhiz. Ask a simple question get kicked for it. Excussssss  meeeee

[grc]

For the prices being charged for those coatings, one would think the coating folks would "break-in" those pipes with a bit of thermal conditioning as part of the process.  You know, run the pipes through an oven to a certain temp, then cool them down, then run them through an oven again, cool them down. 

If I was painting my pipes with a rattle can of high temp paint, I would expect to be responsible for the "break-in" of the coating.  This entire break-in thing from these pipe and coating folks is just a way for them to avoid responsibility when their products don't live up to the lofty claims they make. 

Jerry

[Mr. Wizard]

Thanks Jerry for chiming in. So I take it there should be a warming up period and a cool down for a break in procedure. Then we hear from another learned member here that surfaces must be prep'd in certain ways depending on the material coated. OK, the stars are in alignment now.

I had a conversation a few years back with a developer who stated to coat the outside of a pipe is OK but both inside and out should be coated to maximize the efficiency heat retention or stability. Was told coating the inside of a pipe would be cost prohibited because one would need to prep the inside then insert a spray head into the pipe and spray while removing the sprayer head. The cost for his could range near 100 bucks per head pipe and therefor was cost prohibited. Was also told cold dip even with bake time wasn't the way to go either as it would flake off over time.

The same conversation merged into a performance detail where the discussion valued higher end hi performance motors such as Drag and or true racing machines using SS pipes and expensive coatings. It was suggested to me that coatings being applied to non high performance motors such as an average Harley would be considered overkill in the market yet used to reduce radiant heat. Therefor an inside coating wasn't needed.

Would this be consistent information with the knowledgeable folks here? I really don't know the procedures of coating facts so I'm asking.

[joe_lyons50023]

Here you go.

 "When you receive your ceramic coated item, it will have a partial cure.  It will achieve a full cure once it is installed on the car/motorcycle.  For a full cure you must run your ceramic coated item at operating temperature for a minimum of 1 hour at idle or by driving normally.  If you have any questions concerning your break in period for ceramic, please contact us.
CAUTION: Excessive exhaust heat due to a poorly tuned engine can damage the coating during the cure period. Do not install on a new engine until all adjustments have been made to the camshaft, springs, valves, timing and jetting. Allow the engine to idle, or drive gently for approximately 1 hour or until no vapor/smoke is given off by the coating. MAINTAIN adequate ventilation during this process.
 
Breaking in an engine with freshly painted ceramic coated headers WILL result in damage to the coating. Ceramic coated headers require several heat cycles and/or an hour run of your engine at idle or driving normally to fully cure before they will withstand extreme heat. Bonehead Performance recommends using uncoated cast iron exhaust manifolds or old uncoated headers to break in new engines to avoid coating damage.  The use of header wraps can cause the header tubes to crack or rust due to excessive heat and moisture build–up. Bonehead Performance does not recommend the use of header wraps.
Customer is responsible for final break in.  Ceramic coated items cannot be installed on a motor in which the internals need to be run to be broken in due to the extreme temperatures achieved during a new break in.  Bonehead Performance is not liable for items that are not broken in properly." 

From the website that was thrown in your face.

[Mr. Wizard]

Well.... there ya go

Thanks for posting and thank you Bonehead Performance

[porthole]

I have had 2 sets of pipes ceramic coated, inside and out, Same vendor - Jet Hot, different locations.
1st set was coated when new, second set was about 20K miles.

Neither time did I get or ask for break in instructions. Naive maybe.
Both sets were installed and the bike run normally.

The 1st set after 20K miles or so still looked almost the same as the day installed.
The second set had a noticeable change of finish near the heads after 20 minutes.
Both coatings seem to be still well intact.

I don't remember the "color" and the choices have changed, but the original set was a bright or chrome finish (no chrome at all, just a name)

Mine looked similar to Fuzznuts' when his were done.

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=36311.msg576648#msg576648

[joe_lyons50023]

I figured I would post these up also.  Not a big deal but it is what it is. Black or silver or whatever color can have the elements affect them.

[HOGMIKE]

Just for an FYI:
I've had this header on 2 different bikes starting in '09, total of 120K miles on them. Mild steel.
 

[HOGMIKE]

Another shot......

[HOGMIKE]

Last one.........

[HOGMIKE]

Wish I could figure out how to get those all on one post.

Just waiting on some new "quiet" mufflers.

[OBB]

Wish I could figure out how to get those all on one post.

Just waiting on some new "quiet" mufflers.

Photobucket works quite well for that.

[North Georgia Hawg]

So what have we learned here, gents?

What I've learned (well, more like decided, really...) is that any vendor whose representatives make claims about their products here, and who don't have the common decency to register on CVOHarley as a Vendor, and who won't give the standard 10% CVOHarley member discount... will never get a single penny of revenue from me.

There are PLENTY of solid vendors who are registered as a Vendor here and who DO give the discount... and I've bought a good deal from them over the years. I got the 10% off on a nice pair of Fox Creek lined deerskin gauntlet gloves just a few days ago, actually. Can't wait to try them out!

Ken