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[OILCAN1]

Has anyone tried gearing changes on their 110 powered 6 speed. The 110's deliver some phenominal torgue so they pull well I was just curios about being able to actually use six gear below 75. I don't mind riding 85 everywhere but sooner or later Johnny Law is gona throw the book at me.

[SBB]

Has anyone tried gearing changes on their 110 powered 6 speed. The 110's deliver some phenominal torgue so they pull well I was just curios about being able to actually use six gear below 75. I don't mind riding 85 everywhere but sooner or later Johnny Law is gona throw the book at me.

OC

I may be out here in left field but my 09 pulls well in 6th at a whole lot lower MPH.
I think the 09's are geared lower (higher numerically) than the 07 and 08's.
Maybe a change to the 09 gearing will help.
If that's financially possibly!
Just a thought.

 

[OILCAN1]

I'm not exacatly sure what the 09 gearing is hell i'm not exactly sure what my 07 gearing is, but I do seem to remember reading some were that they did lower the gearing on the 09's. Do you know how many RPM's you are running at 70 mph?

[SBB]

I'm not exacatly sure what the 09 gearing is hell i'm not exactly sure what my 07 gearing is, but I do seem to remember reading some were that they did lower the gearing on the 09's. Do you know how many RPM's you are running at 70 mph?

OC

Sorry bud I don't.
And it's raining here so I will check Sunday!

 

[opee6969]

Mine pulls in sixth gear well from 55mph and up. I'm not sure what the RPM's are at 70mph, but here's a shot of 80mph. The rear sprocket increased from 66 tooth to 68 tooth making sixth gear a lot more functional.

[OILCAN1]

I think Evolution industries makes a primary sprocket that changes the gear ratio so you don't have to take everything apart to get to the front drive sproket, but I will have to check into the rear drive spocket this might be the way to go.

[JDOFLHRIDER]

I think when you change the drive pulley you might have to do something with the speedo ,motorman said I could change drive pulley by a couple teeth with out putting a new drive belt on. I havn't checked to see whats needed to adjust the speedo yet. RIDE SAFE JDO

[OILCAN1]

Is it one tooth on the drive equals three on the driven? I know its something like that but not exactly sure.

[Keats]

This is what I understand to be true, but unconfirmed.

final drive ratio changed in 2008 from 3.19 to 2.79  2006, 2007 to 2008

rear sprocket from a 70 tooth to a 66 tooth IDS drive sprocket giving a taller final drive (lowered rpms at highway speeds)

do not know if a 32 tooth front sprocket standard on both years but, 2008 has a 32 tooth front sprocket.

2009 has a 68 tooth rear sprocket with a IDS drive.   IDS drive not avail in a 70 tooth configuration

changing the 2008  32 front and 66 tooth rear sprockets to a 30 tooth front and 70 tooth rear sprockets gets the final drive ratio to a 3.19 which is the same as 2006 and 2007 Ultra's which

gives it more acceleration and less top end.

I have not confirmed these numbers, so if anyone can confirm it would help.

  

[grc]

04-06   Engine 25  Clutch 36  Trans Output 32  Rear Wheel 70     Final Drive Ratio  3.15:1
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
07-08   Engine 34  Clutch 46  Trans Output 32  Rear Wheel 66     Final Drive Ratio  2.78:1
07-08                                                   31                                                 2.87:1
07-08                                                   30                                                 2.97:1
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
09        Engine 34  Clutch 46  Trans Output 32  Rear Wheel 68     Final Drive Ratio  2.86:1
09                                                        31                                                  2.96:1
09                                                        30                                                  3.06:1
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My mind went blank on the pre '04 engine sprocket size, I can't remember when it went from 24 to 25 (3.37 to 3.15).

The 30 and 31 tooth trans output sprockets are available from Baker and I believe Andrews as well.  The problem is that any changes made at that point will require speedometer recalibration.  I still haven't seen an alternative engine sprocket other than a solid (non-compensator) version, which would be the easiest and best way to change ratios if it were available.  Changing the rear wheel sprocket is problematic, since the larger size from earlier models is wider and is not IDS compatible.  At this point the trans sprocket is probably the best option.

Jerry

[SBB]

04-06   Engine 25  Clutch 36  Trans Output 32  Rear Wheel 70     Final Drive Ratio  3.15:1
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
07-08   Engine 34  Clutch 46  Trans Output 32  Rear Wheel 66     Final Drive Ratio  2.78:1
07-08                                                   31                                                 2.87:1
07-08                                                   30                                                 2.97:1
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
09        Engine 34  Clutch 46  Trans Output 32  Rear Wheel 68     Final Drive Ratio  2.86:1
09                                                        31                                                  2.96:1
09                                                        30                                                  3.06:1
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My mind went blank on the pre '04 engine sprocket size, I can't remember when it went from 24 to 25 (3.37 to 3.15).

The 30 and 31 tooth trans output sprockets are available from Baker and I believe Andrews as well.  The problem is that any changes made at that point will require speedometer recalibration.  I still haven't seen an alternative engine sprocket other than a solid (non-compensator) version, which would be the easiest and best way to change ratios if it were available.  Changing the rear wheel sprocket is problematic, since the larger size from earlier models is wider and is not IDS compatible.  At this point the trans sprocket is probably the best option.

Jerry

When all else fails ask Jerry!
Thanks Jerry!

 

[Keats]

04-06   Engine 25  Clutch 36  Trans Output 32  Rear Wheel 70     Final Drive Ratio  3.15:1
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
07-08   Engine 34  Clutch 46  Trans Output 32  Rear Wheel 66     Final Drive Ratio  2.78:1
07-08                                                   31                                                 2.87:1
07-08                                                   30                                                 2.97:1
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
09        Engine 34  Clutch 46  Trans Output 32  Rear Wheel 68     Final Drive Ratio  2.86:1
09                                                        31                                                  2.96:1
09                                                        30                                                  3.06:1
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My mind went blank on the pre '04 engine sprocket size, I can't remember when it went from 24 to 25 (3.37 to 3.15).

The 30 and 31 tooth trans output sprockets are available from Baker and I believe Andrews as well.  The problem is that any changes made at that point will require speedometer recalibration.  I still haven't seen an alternative engine sprocket other than a solid (non-compensator) version, which would be the easiest and best way to change ratios if it were available.  Changing the rear wheel sprocket is problematic, since the larger size from earlier models is wider and is not IDS compatible.  At this point the trans sprocket is probably the best option.

Jerry

Since I have the attention of the Master (thanks Jerry for the exact numbers)
I can get a 09 rear sprocket and keep the IDS drive in a 68 tooth config. (would rather have 70 tooth, but not made with IDS)   

 Have any idea what the final drive ratio would be only changing rear?  duh! obviously from a 2.78 to 2.86

Is the original belt big enough to handle a 2 tooth increase?

A 30 tooth front with a 68 tooth rear gets me close to the 3.15 ratio of the 06's

[grc]

Since I have the attention of the Master (thanks Jerry for the exact numbers)
I can get a 09 rear sprocket and keep the IDS drive in a 68 tooth config. (would rather have 70 tooth, but not made with IDS)   

 Have any idea what the final drive ratio would be only changing rear?  duh! obviously from a 2.78 to 2.86

Is the original belt big enough to handle a 2 tooth increase?

A 30 tooth front with a 68 tooth rear gets me close to the 3.15 ratio of the 06's

I've heard people say that the original belt would handle a two tooth increase, but I think that is going to depend on each individual bike due to build tolerances.  If you look at where the axle is lined up currently in the swingarm slot, if it's currently fairly well centered I would say two teeth should be OK.  Of course, if you reduce the output sprocket one or two teeth at the same time as you add two teeth at the year, it should definitely fit.  You need to verify if the '09 sprocket will actually fit the '07-'08 rear wheels, however.  I thought they changed the sprocket and wheel to eliminate the bowl for the IDS in '09, making the damper more of an integral part of the rear wheel?  Haven't seen one torn down yet.

I'm not sure why no one has come out with a different compensator gear, but in my opinion that would be by far the best solution.  How about the clutch gear, I haven't looked into that one, is anyone aware of aftermarket parts for that?

Jerry

[hdbrad03]

I not 100% sure but I think the MOCO built the IDS into the wheel hub on the 09's. Different design than the 08's retro to 07's. Got to keep us guessing.


 
   Brad

[grc]

I not 100% sure but I think the MOCO built the IDS into the wheel hub on the 09's. Different design than the 08's retro to 07's. Got to keep us guessing.


 
   Brad

They like to keep us guessing, and I think they are also purposely making it harder to change gearing because gearing affects emissions.  Emissions regs are in terms of grams per mile, and anything you do to significantly alter the engine revolutions per mile will in fact change the emissions numbers.  Not sure if the aces at H-D actually thought of that or not, but it's either believe that or believe they just like to screw with us.  I tend to lean toward both.

Jerry

[dartman]

OC 1, The difference in performance between my 07 SE Ultra, and its replacement an 09 SE Road Glide is hard to believe, The 07 was worthless in 6th gear below 70 mph , the 09 with two teeth more pulls nicely from 60 on, making for a much more useable drive train.

[SBB]

I'm not exacatly sure what the 09 gearing is hell i'm not exactly sure what my 07 gearing is, but I do seem to remember reading some were that they did lower the gearing on the 09's. Do you know how many RPM's you are running at 70 mph?

OC

We rode a few miles today.
To answer your question.
With the speedometer showing 70 the tach shows almost 2600.
Maybe 2550?
But just because the speedo showed 70 was that accurate?
The tach shows 2200, 2400, 2600, 2800 and the needle was between 24 and 2600 @70mph and I would call it closer to 2600.
Hope that helps.

 

[SBB]

OC

We rode a few miles today.
To answer your question.
With the speedometer showing 70 the tach shows almost 2600.
Maybe 2550?
But just because the speedo showed 70 was that accurate?
The tach shows 2200, 2400, 2600, 2800 and the needle was between 24 and 2600 @70mph and I would call it closer to 2600.
Hope that helps.

 

Quoting myself! 
Always feel like Hoist when I do that.
But Jerry (GRC) tell us if my numbers are accurate?
09 SEUC4 I show approx 2550 RPM at 70 MPH, is that close Jerry?

 

[grc]

Besides the two tooth difference in the rear pulley, there is most likely a difference in the circumference of the rear tire that will also change the effective gear ratio.  What tire is on the rear of the '09 versus the '07?

Jerry

[SBB]

Besides the two tooth difference in the rear pulley, there is most likely a difference in the circumference of the rear tire that will also change the effective gear ratio.  What tire is on the rear of the '09 versus the '07?

Jerry

It's a 180 but not sure how tall?

[Dan_Lockwood]

I can't say for positive, but today at 75 mph I was reading just about 2,900 rpm in 6th gear.  When I ride I ride two up and even if I slow down to 55 or 60 mph without shifting, I can ease on the throttle without trying to lug it, and it increases in speed very quickly.  I have an '08 SERK.

I have no problems with the speed upper end, although maybe a few more revs wouldn't hurt anything.

All this talk about rear and front sprockets, don't you have to do a complete primary removal to change out the front output sprocket?  The rear sprocket, if you can maintain your stock belt, would be a good choice.  I'm not certain but the belt pitch looks to be about 3/8" or 1/2".  If that's the case two teeth will move the axle approximately one tooth pitch closer to the trans.  Then you have to recalibrate the speedos on the '07s or '08s.

I still think the better option is the Evo Industries clutch hub with the original starter sprocket and a 49th clutch sprocket.  I comes with the new primary chain and you don't have to pull the inner primary cover off.  You also don't have to fuss with the speedo as it's all upstream from the trans.  I think the dollars are a bit more, but the hassle factor may be less overall.  The clutch sprocket and primary chain kit is about $324.00 and I'm not sure what the rear sprocket costs for the rear wheel.  Doing this is about a 5.5% increase in low gear for a better take off and less clutch slipping, especially two up.  If I had this conversion my 75 mph rpm would raise from 2,900 to 3,060, not a lot but enough probably to help out at slightly slower speeds.

I just read the AMI review of the Tri-Glide and one of the things they said in that was that they had to slip the clutch on take off a bit more than they would have thought.  Now if any of the HD bikes need a lower low gear it's the Tri-Glide.

I could see the gear ratio as a benefit if it were a car because they could tout the "increase" in mileage the extra taller ratio provides.  But with bikes I don't hear anything about C.A.F.E. mileage requirements, so why does HD insist on making the rpms so low on these bikes?  Is it emissions related too?

[grc]

OK, here's the info I can find so far.  The rear tire on the '09 Touring models except for the SERG is a D407  180/65B16.  The SERG tire is a D407 180/55B18, which is a lower profile but a larger rim diameter.  The Dunlop site has no information on the actual dimensions of either tire (overall diameter or circumference), so I can't calculate what affect the tire size has on speed versus rpm relative to earlier models, or within the '09 models between the two tire sizes.  It would appear that the SERG's will have different effective gear ratios than the other '09's due to the circumference of the rear tires.

Jerry

[Keats]

I guess I could go back to the original plan of bolting a 06 70 tooth rear sprocket to the wheel and lose the IDS feature and change front from a 32 to a 30 tooth and get a speedo compensator?

at least the final drive would be 3.15 which will give it more get up and go...

[smiley1049]

I put a 30 tooth on mine and they just had to recalibrate the ecm.

[Keats]

I put a 30 tooth on mine and they just had to recalibrate the ecm.

I would expect that a 2 tooth reduction in the drive (front) effects final ratio more than a 2 tooth addition to the rear?

[Fullsac Performance]

I reduced the front belt sprocket from 32 to 30 teeth on my 07 for a final drive of 2.96. Had to go 1 tooth shorter on the belt. The improvement in drivability was amazing. Milage increased, lugging the engine isn't efficient. I believe a 31 tooth front pulley on the 09 will achieve the same final drive of 2.96 (as seen in the chart, Thanks grc) without needing a shorter rear belt. It did throw the speedo off, but my cruise and 6th gear light were uneffected. Other who have changed the primary gearing have reported a loss of cruise and or 6th gear light due to the computer seeing an error in speed VS RPM. To test this, I set my cruise and ever so slightly started to pull in the clutch. The very second the RPM increased the cruise disengaged. Will the 09s loose cruise with a primary gearing change? I'm not going to find out. I do plan on the doing the 30 or 31 tooth front pulley on my 09 EGC when It comes in (DEC 9th!). I'm going to tune with the TTS, so correcting the speedo will be no problem after the gearing change. Again, the improvement the lower final drive made was Huge. And the improvement begins when you let the clutch out in 1st gear. With the 2.96, GPS at 75 mph is 3000 RPM. GPS at 100 mph is 4000 RPM. Just right for touring and passing tree huggers with enough velocity to pull their doors open.

Steve

[MUFFMAN]

I too am going with the 30 tooth front sprocket this winter. Will have to go with a shorter belt. A friend of mine went with a 30 tooth on his 07 96" Ultra with very good results. He now can keep up with me off the line until I get through 2nd gear. Wasn't even close before. His mileage went up about 3 mpg as well. THE MUFFMAN.

[Dan_Lockwood]

I reduced the front belt sprocket from 32 to 30 teeth on my 07 for a final drive of 2.96. Had to go 1 tooth shorter on the belt. The improvement in drivability was amazing. Milage increased, lugging the engine isn't efficient. I believe a 31 tooth front pulley on the 09 will achieve the same final drive of 2.96 (as seen in the chart, Thanks grc) without needing a shorter rear belt. It did throw the speedo off, but my cruise and 6th gear light were uneffected. Other who have changed the primary gearing have reported a loss of cruise and or 6th gear light due to the computer seeing an error in speed VS RPM.

To test this, I set my cruise and ever so slightly started to pull in the clutch. The very second the RPM increased the cruise disengaged. Will the 09s loose cruise with a primary gearing change? I'm not going to find out.

I do plan on the doing the 30 or 31 tooth front pulley on my 09 EGC when It comes in (DEC 9th!). I'm going to tune with the TTS, so correcting the speedo will be no problem after the gearing change. Again, the improvement the lower final drive made was Huge. And the improvement begins when you let the clutch out in 1st gear. With the 2.96, GPS at 75 mph is 3000 RPM. GPS at 100 mph is 4000 RPM. Just right for touring and passing tree huggers with enough velocity to pull their doors open.

Steve

Steve, you raise a point about the cruise control.  But to be honest I think what it did when you pulled in the clutch it tripped a switch and was not actually reading rpms; I think it was a switch that kicked the cruise off.

If we take that same scenario a bit further, the ECM does not know what gear you're in other than when the 6th gear green light comes on in 6th gear.  So if you set the cruise for 60 mph in 5th gear it runs fine and will maintain that speed up or down hills.  Due to the fact that it's actually mechanically connect, motor to rear wheel, the rpms do not go up, only the throttle opens to go up hills etc.  But now take that same 60 mph and shift into 4th gear and set the cruise.  You're now maintaining 60 mph but at several hundred more rpms and the cruise could care less.

I've been a big proponent to just do the clutch housing sprockets in previous posts/threads, but I'm not sure that the actual cost difference is.  With the 30 tooth output sprocket and new rear belt, what did that cost?  Then you have to take off the rear wheel, brakes etc to re-thread the new belt.  You also have to do the whole primary cover removal, primary chain, clutch basket, inner primary housing and mess with all that oil.  So why not just stop there and do the sprocket and chain change?  I've calculated out the percentage increase and rpms etc and it's within about 25 rpms of your 30th sprocket conversion.  Now the clutch sprocket and chain will set a person back $324.00.  So I'm curious what the difference is and I'll figure in all the extra labor to do the output sprocket and drive belt change.

I'm tired of slipping my clutch so much in 1st gear riding two up and I know, like you've said, the performance and economy have come up as well.  This is exactly what I'm looking for.

So if you can share with me the sprocket and belt costs, I would greatly appreciate that.

Thanks.

[grc]

The cruise control will be kicked out by brake application, throttle roll-off, turning off the main switch, speeds higher than 85 mph, speeds below 30 mph, Run/Stop switch moved to off, and any significant increase in rpms, as in when disengaging the clutch.  On the non-ETC models, the cruise module monitors both rpm and vehicle speed.  The kick-out caused by pulling the clutch was due to the rpm difference, not a switch.  Now that they do have a clutch switch for starter interlock purposes, I suppose they could use that input but I don't see any need to change from the rpm based system and I don't believe they have.  Either way, the gearing wouldn't create a problem since it isn't an absolute rpm value the module is looking at, just the current rpm relative to the setpoint rpm.

Jerry

[Gecko]

I'd like to have a seriously lower first gear, a somewhat lower second, and a slightly lower third, but the other three are fine.  With the IDS even 55-60 in sixth gives no complaints.  That's a little more than a third the way to redline, so isn't lugging if you don't wonk it open.  I know overall gearing effects acceleration across the board, but if the main problem is acceleration for passing in sixth, can't we tipple that little lever on the left and use fifth for a while?

[Fullsac Performance]

I can't explain the loss of cruise with the primary gear change, but for a fact some people have posted on VTF they lost cruise and or the 6th gear light when they ran the 30T front primary sprocket. (Not to be confused with the 30T belt Sprocket). 07 cable or 08 ETC? I don't know. I wish I had solid factual info from experience on this but I don't. So maybe out of fear of loosing my cruise, I did the 30T front belt sprocket from Andrews. Cost, 150.00? The 1 tooth shorter belt was around 130.00. Labor was 3 hours and a 6 pack. Increase in performance, priceless.

Steve

[Dan_Lockwood]

I can't explain the loss of cruise with the primary gear change, but for a fact some people have posted on VTF they lost cruise and or the 6th gear light when they ran the 30T front primary sprocket. (Not to be confused with the 30T belt Sprocket). 07 cable or 08 ETC? I don't know. I wish I had solid factual info from experience on this but I don't. So maybe out of fear of loosing my cruise, I did the 30T front belt sprocket from Andrews. Cost, 150.00? The 1 tooth shorter belt was around 130.00. Labor was 3 hours and a 6 pack. Increase in performance, priceless.

Steve

Thanks Steve.

So the cost is about the same with the rear drive belt and output sprocket as to change the clutch / starter sprockets.  And less work, if you're not worried about the cruise issue as you've indicated from the "other" forum members.

GRC, I see what you mean about the sudden rpm increase.  As long as the rpm at the time the cruise is set doesn't increase suddenly, like pulling in the clutch, any gear and any speed (within the ECM limits of course) the cruise will function without issues.

For the life of me I find it had to believe that the motor 30t sprocket would cause the 6th speed light and cruise not to work.  The 6th gear indicator is probably a switch similar to the neutral safety switch that just gets bumper or falls into a divot on the shifter drum.  The sprocket would not have any affect on that, that I can think of.  And again the increase in rpms because of the primary ratio change would not affect the speed sensor as it's on the outboard side of the trans and only reads blips from a gear or rotor for that purpose.

As the winter edges forward here in St. Louis, I think I'll probably go for the 49th clutch housing sprocket change and take my chances with the cruise control.  I know for a fact that the speedo calibration is not affected by doing it on the primary as that's in front of the sensor, unlike the rear ratio change is after the sensor and does affect the speedo calibration.

Thanks to all on the valuable input to this thread.  I didn't start this one nor am I ending it, I just want to say I've learned a lot from it, Thanks...

[grc]

I'd like to have a seriously lower first gear, a somewhat lower second, and a slightly lower third, but the other three are fine.  With the IDS even 55-60 in sixth gives no complaints.  That's a little more than a third the way to redline, so isn't lugging if you don't wonk it open.  I know overall gearing effects acceleration across the board, but if the main problem is acceleration for passing in sixth, can't we tipple that little lever on the left and use fifth for a while?

Baker Powertrain has just what you need, assuming you don't mind spending several thousand dollars for a seven speed gearset.

Jerry

[Gecko]

Baker Powertrain has just what you need, assuming you don't mind spending several thousand dollars for a seven speed gearset.

Jerry

I've considered it.  First is just too tall to get a thousand pounds moving.  On my Evo softail I can just about ease the clutch out without raising the idle and chuff away.  This one it sounds like it is going to stall even with some gas.  It would be nice if someone had just a first gear replacement; I could live with riding around town in second.

[Fullsac Performance]

The explanation for the 6th gear light loss was: Just repeating what I read.
The speedo sensor is on the output shaft of the trans. When the computer sees the correct differential between engine RPM and output shaft RPM, it knows its in 6th gear and turns on the light. When you change the primary ratio, the correct programmed differential for 6th is never achieved. Makes sense. Is it true? I have NFC?

Steve

[OILCAN1]

So if changing the front engine sprocket throws off the speedo can you recalculate it using a SERT as this can change just about all the other functions of the ECM

[Keats]

Electronic Speedometer Adjustment Module
From Dakota Digital
Click to ZOOM!

The SIM-1 electric speed correction module will plug into newer speed sensor harnesses to correct the speedometer and odometer after a change in tire size, pulley size or transmission gearing. The unit plugs directly between the stock Harley transmission sensor and the original speedometer and is easily tucked away into the bike's wiring harness after adjustment is complete.

    * With factory Harley connectors, no cutting or splicing is required.
    * Two push button switches allow the original speedometer reading to be increased or decreased easily.
    * Ability to correct the speed to within 1 MPH or KPH from 50% to 284% of the original reading.
    * Sealed completely from water, dust, and dirt.

The new SIM-1 comes in a smaller size for easier mounting and allows more correction for calibrating more bikes.

Fits Harley Davidson models:

    * 1995-2003 Sportser Models
    * 1996-2006 Softail Models
    * 1996-2005 Dyna Models
    * 2006 and earlier Touring models with Factory Electronic Speedometer

 

[OILCAN1]

It does not list the 2006 and newer dynas or the 2007 and newer everythung else which leads me to belive something is different on the factory six speed bikes. Maybe this is not the case but it's just an observation.

[Fullsac Performance]

So if changing the front engine sprocket throws off the speedo can you recalculate it using a SERT as this can change just about all the other functions of the ECM

With the TTS, you can recalibrate the speedo. The Sert you can not.

[Greaseball]

This is a great thread, I've just read through all of it!  Now I have a new twist to throw at those that are running an '07 and '08......

It doesn't appear that the '09 IDS rear belt sprocket will bolt up to an '07 - '08 rear wheel.  However, I've read a thread where a 70 tooth SPORTSTER sprocket was used on an '07 - '08 touring bike and it was a bolt-on change.  The Sportster sproket is the correct belt width, but not IDS.  I almost went this route on my '08 Road Glide and had I kept the bike, I would have tried it.  Used Sportster sprockets on ebay or craigslist can't be that expensive.

Here's the thread....check it out for yourselves.....
http://groups.msn.com/harleytechtalk/tc88fathead.msnw?action=get_message&mview=0&ID_Message=1392561&LastModified=4675685357966403209

[Dan_Lockwood]

So if changing the front engine sprocket throws off the speedo can you recalculate it using a SERT as this can change just about all the other functions of the ECM

I really need to open my manuals and check this electronic speedo sensor out, but I still stand by my earlier statement.

If you change the primary sprockets either motor or clutch basket, the speedo should still be unaffected.  The speedo sensor is as someone said, on the trans output shaft and is "after" the primary case.

Now it seems to make sense on the 6th gear light logic that was stated, but I'm wondering why they would do that.  If they wrote software to do that, why not have a readout for all the gears on the speedo?  If it were just a comparison of shaft speed and motor rpms, it would SO easy to have all 6 gears show up on the speedo.

After reading for the past year or more all the experiences you guys have had and all the strange things the MOCO has done over the years, I'm not going to second guess them without more research on the manual or ever the electrical drawing looking for the sensor and the 6th gear switch, if it is there at all.

Has Baker announced the pricing yet for their new 7 speed gear set?  So if someone used the Baker setup they would screw up their 6th gear read out light as well, as the ratio would still be wrong compared to the preset ratio the ECM is looking for, if it of course a software indicator.

As so many have said before, as well as myself complaining about this, the only problem I'm really having is the 1st gear take off with the slipping of the clutch.  Even in parking lots you have to pull in on the clutch because your idle mph is too fast.  On my old '76 FLH 4 speed I can ride two up and take off in low without any issues at all.  Granted the gear spacing is NOT what one might call close ratio, but it does do the job quite well.

Sorry for rambling again guys.

Later dudes and dudettes........

[Fullsac Performance]

Curiosity was killing me.
Took my 07 EGC for a ride today, Shifted in 6th and the 6th gear light comes on. Pulled in the clutch, light goes out. Coasted a little ways, let the clutch back out, light comes on. Even slip the clutch ever so slightly, the light goes out. Somebody try this on an 08-09 Fly by wire and tell us what happens? Apparently, the computer on the 07, does use the differential between engine RPM and tranny shaft output RPM to detect 6th gear. The clutch slips even slightly, RPM differential falls out of the "window" and the light goes out.

Steve

[JDOFLHRIDER]

I bought a thunder max ecm with auto tune and in the set up there is something for setting up the six speed . The Tech at harley said like someone earlier said when certain conditions are met it the ecm (computer) it turns the 6 speed light on ,he made it sound like it is done with ecm and no switches. RIDE SAFE JDO

[timo482]

im wanting a deeper first gear too....... the rest are fine - everybody is making all these cool gear sets - all that is wrong is first.

first is just so tall

uphill at a stop sign just sucks

to

[OILCAN1]

I Want lowere across the board definatley first gear, but I want sixth to be slightly lower. I don't mind running 85 I just don't want HAVE TO in order to be in a usabble power range in sixth gear.

 On another note I am definatley going to look into the sportster rear sprocket as I am just about ready for another rear tire.

[Keats]

Nothing can be done that will not effect all gears unless you crack open gear case and change 1 gear (6th gear) or get a complete new transmission. I do not even know if you can get a new 6th gear to mount in the case that would shorten 6th.
Seems far easier to just shorten the entire drive line as close as to  a 3.00 to a 3.19 final ratio as possible.

[Dan_Lockwood]

While riding yesterday, I was on a slight down slope and was able to have the bike in 6th gear and in cruise.  I tried to pull in on the clutch to see what happens with the 6th gear light.  I know someone here said that the light went out when the rpms went up from pulling in on the clutch.  I was able to pull in on the clutch "just" enough to turn off the light without disengaging the clutch at all; so rpms remained the same and the light went out.  If you're putting it into 6th gear the light doesn't come on until you have the clutch all the way out, then it lights up.

I looked in the electrical drawing and found a clutch switch, but did not find a 6th gear switch shown anywhere.  So I'm still not sure of what activates it other than what someone suggested; certain mph and certain rpm and ECM knows the gear selection and turns on the 6th gear light.

When I go in for my service and campaigns, I'll ask how it all works, if they know that is.