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[US.Army.Retired]

I am looking for advice for my 2010 SECU. I have changed my head pipe to the V&H Power Duels, Installed the 1.75 baffles and TTS Master Tune, but still need to change my air cleaner. I spoke with Steve at Fullsac and he indicated to install a Big Sucker A/C. The Big Sucker is designed for a 50 MM throttle body and everything indicates it will to work on the CVO due to the 58 MM throttle body.

Should I install the Screeamin’ Eagle Pro Air Cleaner and Breather Kit – 58mm Throttle Body – part # 29515-08?

Or

Should I install the Big Sucker – Don’t know which part #?

Or

Is there a better route?


John

[CVORick]

I would either use the "Ventilator" from HD or the Stage One SE Air Cleaner.  The CFM of air is not that much different.  Other opinions may very.  Air flow is important, but how do you want it to look?

[grc]

I am looking for advice for my 2010 SECU. I have changed my head pipe to the V&H Power Duels, Installed the 1.75 baffles and TTS Master Tune, but still need to change my air cleaner. I spoke with Steve at Fullsac and he indicated to install a Big Sucker A/C. The Big Sucker is designed for a 50 MM throttle body and everything indicates it will to work on the CVO due to the 58 MM throttle body.

Should I install the Screeamin’ Eagle Pro Air Cleaner and Breather Kit – 58mm Throttle Body – part # 29515-08?

Or

Should I install the Big Sucker – Don’t know which part #?

Or

Is there a better route?


John

John, unless you had someone change your throttle body out for the larger SE Pro part, you don't have a 58mm throttle body.  The stock TB is 50mm, and if you were to decide to install a SE Pro air cleaner you would need to stick with the one listed for all '08 and later Touring models, P/N 29260-08.  Per the catalog, "Fits ’08-later Touring and Trike models with Original Equipment 50mm Throttle Body. ’08-later CVO models require separate purchase of Air Cleaner Cover P/N 29121-07.*"

Now, if it were me I would take a pass on that particular part from the MoCo, and if you really want that style of air cleaner I'd suggest you go with the Ness Big Sucker.  The reasoning is that the Ness unit comes with a real K&N oiled gauze filter, whereas the H-D unit comes with a washable paper element that has not been terribly reliable (as in falling apart in 5000 miles).  The Ness comes in multiple versions, follow this link for the ones that fit '08 and up Touring models:

http://www.arlenness.com/c-1320-big-sucker-air-filter-kits-08-10-flt-models.aspx


Jerry

[jesse111]

Just installed the Ventilator today. I like the looks better than the Ness products or anything else out there for that matter. But I must admit, I'm not too thrilled with the paper element. I got it knowing the issues though and I'm actually hoping K&N comes out with a replacement eventually. The design just looks to good to pass up in my personal opinion.

[US.Army.Retired]

John, unless you had someone change your throttle body out for the larger SE Pro part, you don't have a 58mm throttle body.  The stock TB is 50mm, and if you were to decide to install a SE Pro air cleaner you would need to stick with the one listed for all '08 and later Touring models, P/N 29260-08.   Per the catalog, "Fits ’08-later Touring and Trike models with Original Equipment 50mm Throttle Body. ’08-later CVO models require separate purchase of Air Cleaner Cover P/N 29121-07.*"

Now, if it were me I would take a pass on that particular part from the MoCo, and if you really want that style of air cleaner I'd suggest you go with the Ness Big Sucker.  The reasoning is that the Ness unit comes with a real K&N oiled gauze filter, whereas the H-D unit comes with a washable paper element that has not been terribly reliable (as in falling apart in 5000 miles).  The Ness comes in multiple versions, follow this link for the ones that fit '08 and up Touring models:

http://www.arlenness.com/c-1320-big-sucker-air-filter-kits-08-10-flt-models.aspx


Jerry

According to the parts department 2010 SECU came with the 58mm throttle body?

[Boatman]

I got the TTS and baffles from Fullsac but did not get the Arlen Ness from Steve for two reasons:

1)  the chrome back plate was made in China

2)  You leave the black TBI support plate on with this air cleaner per instructions from Arlen Ness website.

I did not get the Harley Screamin Eagle air cleaner because the element is not a K&N as GRC stated.

I ordered my air cleaner assy from Fuelmoto.  I bought theirs because:

1) They use Harley's Screamin Eagle backplate (and I painted it Granite to match the VTwin).

2) They use the K&N air filter element.

3) You remove the TBI black support brace with this setup.

I also retained the stock air cleaner cover.

I do not know what the Throttle Body size but GRC's word is gospel.
 

[US.Army.Retired]

The best part of this site is that most the time people are more educated then the person behind the parts counter.

If I install the Big Sucker can retained the stock air cleaner cover?

[grc]

According to the parts department 2010 SECU came with the 58mm throttle body?

I think you need to consult a different member of the parts department, or perhaps a different parts department.  The 58mm throttle body, according to the information I have, is still an SE Pro "Racing Use Only" part and is not standard on any current Harley.  The attachment is a cut-and-paste from the 2010 SE Pro catalog.


Jerry

[Twolanerider]

46mm in 07.  08 made the change to 50mm.  It's not uncommon for the parts countermen or the service staff to mistkenly assume that the CVO bikes have whatever is biggest or fanciest already on them.  HD's advertising and perecpetion there works against the accuracy of what the bikes really are.

[CVORick]

The best part of this site is that most the time people are more educated then the person behind the parts counter.

If I install the Big Sucker can retained the stock air cleaner cover?

YES

[cahdbiker]

US.ARMY.TURNKEY, I went into my dealer to get the highlflow HD kit for my 09 SEUC. My parts man advised me to purchase the parts separately because you can get the breather in chrome, still use your original air cleaner cover, and buy a K&N filter to fit. If you want to PM me I will scan the invoice with all the part numbers on it. Hopefully the parts for the 09 will work on your 2010. I installed the highflow kit before I did the stage 1 Fullsac setup and I could feel the difference in throttle response. CAHDBIKER

[HOGMIKE]

US.ARMY.TURNKEY, I went into my dealer to get the highlflow HD kit for my 09 SEUC. My parts man advised me to purchase the parts separately because you can get the breather in chrome, still use your original air cleaner cover, and buy a K&N filter to fit. If you want to PM me I will scan the invoice with all the part numbers on it. Hopefully the parts for the 09 will work on your 2010. I installed the highflow kit before I did the stage 1 Fullsac setup and I could feel the difference in throttle response. CAHDBIKER

FWIW:
We saw a 2HP gain on the dyno just by removing the SE filter and cover from my bike!

[OhioDave]

Installed the Ness product on my 09, stock cover fits great and like others mentioned, you get the benefit of a K&N filter.

[US.Army.Retired]

Installed the Ness Big Sucker and everything was easy except the o rings suck.

THANKS FOR ALL THE HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[grc]

US.ARMY.TURNKEY, I went into my dealer to get the highlflow HD kit for my 09 SEUC. My parts man advised me to purchase the parts separately because you can get the breather in chrome, still use your original air cleaner cover, and buy a K&N filter to fit. If you want to PM me I will scan the invoice with all the part numbers on it. Hopefully the parts for the 09 will work on your 2010. I installed the highflow kit before I did the stage 1 Fullsac setup and I could feel the difference in throttle response. CAHDBIKER

CAHDBIKER, I started a thread several years back called "Roll Your Own SE Air Cleaner" that listed all the parts necessary to create your own air cleaner without having to pay for the POS filter H-D supplies instead of the K&N.  The numbers I listed were good for the older models up through '07, you might want to update that thread or start another for the '08 and later folks if you have all the part numbers available.  It became a very popular idea, and many dealers started doing it that way rather than deal with the problems created by the cheap filter element from H-D.

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=5725.0


Jerry

[Opossum]

CAHDBIKER, I started a thread several years back called "Roll Your Own SE Air Cleaner" that listed all the parts necessary to create your own air cleaner without having to pay for the POS filter H-D supplies instead of the K&N.  The numbers I listed were good for the older models up through '07, you might want to update that thread or start another for the '08 and later folks if you have all the part numbers available.  It became a very popular idea, and many dealers started doing it that way rather than deal with the problems created by the cheap filter element from H-D.

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=5725.0


Jerry

YES PLEASE!

[480Ruger]

Has anyone had the stock CVO cover pop the center out of a new K&N filter?  I swapped the paper filter out for one and after a week it fell off next to my leg on the interstate.  I called K&N and verified I had the correct Part # for 08-later touring.  They want me to send it back with a new one on the way and do a little testing for them with a grease pen and my cover.  No charge to me and I’m glad I didn’t drop the cover.

[grc]

Click on the attached pdf file for the instructions and part listing for the SE air cleaner kit for the '08 and up Touring models.  The part number for the chrome backplate, if you prefer that over the standard aluminum, is 29624-08, $49.95 MSRP.  The K&N filter part number for this application is HD-0818.


Jerry

[US.Army.Retired]

So, this looks like a great option.

Pro - Removes the support bracket. This has to stay if you install the Big Sucker.
Cons -

Does anyone know the cost if you get the parts this way?

Questions - The directions indicate you have to remove the fuel tank. I assume this is to reach the mounting screws on the support bracket.


Is this list correct?

1 O-ring, #2-113 (4) 11292
2 Backplate 29239-08
3 Gasket, throttle body 29241-08
4 Stud, mounting (3) 29447-99A
5 Bolt, breather, (2) 29267-08
6 Screw, hex socket buttonhead (3) 3938
7 K&N filter HD-0818

[Boatman]

Questions - The directions indicate you have to remove the fuel tank. I assume this is to reach the mounting screws on the support bracket.

The only question I can answer is this one.  No, you don't have to remove the gas tank to remove the support bracket.  (I have done 2 bikes with the Fuelmoto).   I believe it takes a 1/8" L shaped allen wrench.  it is not easy as the screws come out hard all the way 1/4 turn at a time.   With the Fuelmoto instructions, they say to remove the bracket with an allen wrench.  Hope this helps.

[dave29]

So maybe I missed something. Is there a K&N air filter that will fit the stock air cleaner housing for my two bikes: 2010 SE Streetglide, 2009 SE Ultra?
Thanks mucho.

[US.Army.Retired]

I dont know if the K&N Filter will work with the stock setup, but CAHDBIKER posted a parts list to build your own.

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=47711.0


HD chrome backplate kit: 29624-08                                                        $49.95
HD HDP O-Ring 11292 (needed 4 at $1.07 each )                                      $4.28
HD HDM Gasket 29241-08                                                                     $8.95
HD HDP A/C Mounting Stud 29447-99A (needed 3 at $12.95 each)              $38.85
HD HDM Torx, SBH Screw 3938 (needed 3 at $1.50 each)                          $4.50
K & N Air Filter (I don't think this is a Harley Part no. 1011-1410)                 $69.95
                                                                                        TOTAL     $176.48
 

[grc]

So maybe I missed something. Is there a K&N air filter that will fit the stock air cleaner housing for my two bikes: 2010 SE Streetglide, 2009 SE Ultra?
Thanks mucho.

The K&N HD-1508 will fit the Ultra plastic airbox if that is what you are asking.  There is no K&N replacement for the filter on the SESG yet. 

http://www.knfilters.com/search/product.aspx?Prod=HD-1508


Jerry

[grc]

Exploded view and parts list attached:


Jerry

[Talon]

Doherty Power Pacc.   

http://www.dohertymachine.com/index.php?cPath=2_27&osCsid=95ed657abc4bd9807ce1c95851b45a69

[grc]

Has anyone had the stock CVO cover pop the center out of a new K&N filter?  I swapped the paper filter out for one and after a week it fell off next to my leg on the interstate.  I called K&N and verified I had the correct Part # for 08-later touring.  They want me to send it back with a new one on the way and do a little testing for them with a grease pen and my cover.  No charge to me and I’m glad I didn’t drop the cover.

I haven't had that experience personally, but several folks on this site posted about the same thing shortly after H-D changed the CVO covers from the old round center section to the new rectangular center section.  I hadn't seen any postings about that for quite awhile, until this one of yours.

Did the weld on the nut fail, or did the metal end plate break near the nut?  If the end plate broke out, that is usually caused by excessive movement and vibration.  The use of the current version CVO cover can cause that, and in fact H-D warns about that possibility in the verbage with the SE air cleaner kits they sell.  They recommend replacing the CVO cover with one from a standard model with the round center section.  I know there are quite a few on this site still running the CVO cover without a problem, but if it were me I would take steps to make sure that cover to filter fit was improved to prevent what happened to you.  Having the A/C cover fall off while riding is not only expensive, it can be rather dangerous for not only the rider but for anyone following.  If you use the site search and type in "center nut", you will see a listing of some of the previous posts concerning this same problem.

When you get the new filter, place it into the cover (off the bike) and line it up with the center hole.  Make note of how the end of the filter does not touch the cover all the way around like it does on the old style covers.  If you want to make sure you don't have a repeat problem, you need to provide additional support between the cover and the end of the filter to eliminate any rocking or movement. 


Jerry

[CVORick]

[quote

When you get the new filter, place it into the cover (off the bike) and line it up with the center hole.  Make note of how the end of the filter does not touch the cover all the way around like it does on the old style covers.  If you want to make sure you don't have a repeat problem, you need to provide additional support between the cover and the end of the filter to eliminate any rocking or movement. 


Jerry
[/quote]

Thanks Jerry.  Great tip.  Was getting ready to put on the K&N-0818 in place of the paper Harley filter.

[worshipduder]

I got the TTS and baffles from Fullsac but did not get the Arlen Ness from Steve for two reasons:

1)  the chrome back plate was made in China

2)  You leave the black TBI support plate on with this air cleaner per instructions from Arlen Ness website.

I did not get the Harley Screamin Eagle air cleaner because the element is not a K&N as GRC stated.

I ordered my air cleaner assy from Fuelmoto.  I bought theirs because:

1) They use Harley's Screamin Eagle backplate (and I painted it Granite to match the VTwin).

2) They use the K&N air filter element.

3) You remove the TBI black support brace with this setup.

I also retained the stock air cleaner cover.

I do not know what the Throttle Body size but GRC's word is gospel.
 

now THAT deserves a pic!

[Boatman]

now THAT deserves a pic!

 

[dep47]

I also have a question.  If I just change out the stock AC, with a Big Sucker, on my 010 CVO Ultra do I have to  remap the engine or add a turner to keep it from damaging the engine or running to lean?

[480Ruger]

It did pull the raised center section out of the filter which was a K&N HD-0818.  I'm working on a foam ring that will fill the gap and support the new 10' SEUC cover.  Thanks for the info!

[Talon]

It did pull the raised center section out of the filter which was a K&N HD-0818.  I'm working on a foam ring that will fill the gap and support the new 10' SEUC cover.  Thanks for the info!

Not sure foam will work, to spongy might not stay tight. I'd measure the gap and make a metal spacer. You can use modeling clay on the back of the cover, then install and tighten until it feels like it's just getting tight, take it back off and measure the thickness. Then make a spacer that thickness, or use washers to make the same thickness.

Craig

[grc]

I also have a question.  If I just change out the stock AC, with a Big Sucker, on my 010 CVO Ultra do I have to  remap the engine or add a turner to keep it from damaging the engine or running to lean?

OK, here's the theory.  On the bikes with closed loop operation (O² sensors), the sensors provide feedback to the ECM which then adjusts the time the injectors are open to maintain the air-fuel ratio specified in the calibration (map).  While this is going on, the ECM also stores information about how much correction it has to apply to maintain that AFR and applies that information going forward.  The real purpose of this system is to be able to correct for variations or wear in various parts over time.  It can only make corrections up to a fairly limited point, however.  It's not designed to compensate for major changes in air or fuel flow, like what would occur with cam changes, head work, bigger intakes, etc.

If you change out the pipes or air cleaner, and the engine runs OK and doesn't set any codes, that means your changes did not exceed what the system can automatically adjust for.  So your engine won't be any leaner than it was before, and it won't destroy itself.  However, since the stock setup is very lean you won't see much improvement for all the money you just spent on those pipes and air cleaner, and your engine will continue to run hot just like when it was stock.  My suggestion:  don't waste your money opening up the intake or exhaust if you don't plan to spend a few more bucks to tune the bike.  If you want it to run like stock, leave it stock.  If you want it to run smoother, cooler, and all around just better, even with no modifications, get it tuned by a competent tuner.


JMHO - Jerry

[frankshd]

good info jerry,  thanks