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[CVO2FIXUP]

 Just read this.   

  http://flip.it/mhSwj

[twinotter]

OR just maybe the buying public has received the word that HD is currently producing motorcycles with less quality than any others in the market.
In Harley never ending shove for profit, they have managed to downgrade the quality of almost every part on the motorcycles they build. Numerous redesigns and supposed upgrades have proven to be faulty or just plain bad engineering. There are examples of poor quality in almost every part. I've seen cases not machined flat where they meet, lifters, even the latest upgrades that have now become an almost must change item BEFORE imminent failure. After 8 yrs, the compensator they designed in 07 still hasn't proved to be working properly, even with several supposed "improvements". Crankshafts so soft, they need dual shock unloading systems in the drive train to almost stop them from shifting.
All of this and the lists of problems continues on and on, but the price of the product sure hasn't changed, only went UP. The famous catch fraise from Harley when asked about issues has become 'DON'T WORRY, THEY ALL DO THAT". Seeing their sales drop by 14% in the last quarter, and a further 4% in this one is proof to me that the HD faithful has finally seen the lights, and stopped buying the bullchit and hype of HD selling a totally inferior product. Even the most ardent HD fan has now decided they will not buy a new HD when all you get is imminent problems. I've bought only one,an 01 Dyna,  and would never even consider a new one. fwiw twinotter

[easternhotrod]

I posted last fall about the engine vibration in my 2015 CVO road glide.
After many, many, visits to different Harley dealers with no dealer wanting or for that matter Harley wanting to get into the engine because of the vibration I bit the bullet with only 4000kilometres on the bike I tore it apart.
Results were .008 crankshaft run out.
Scored crank journal where it runs in the cam plate which also had wear.
Worn oil pump
Scuffed piston skirts
Scored cylinder walls
Cylinders had bizarre vertical wear marks
Many fasteners were loose
Rocker assembly bolts that hold the rocker shafts in had witness marks were the rocker shafts were rocking back and forth hitting the shank of the bolts.
And what did Harley do about it absolutely nothing!

[GregKhougaz]

Ouch!      Sorry to read your post.      What recourse do you have in Canada?   

[Ridgerunr]

Hopefully you'll take pictures and contact the consumer agencies you posted about previously, in addition to Harley Canada, and USA. I know they have worn you down, but hate to see you get hosed like this. Nobody should have to endure this BS. Best Wishes.

[easternhotrod]

Thanks guys.
Yup, Taking lots of pictures. Going to take the parts and the pictures to the dealer where I bought the bike next week and see what they have to say. I'm sure I will get the same song and dance. They all do that. Its normal wear. Yada, Yada, Yada.

[HUBBARD]

If I was having that much trouble, I would fix my Motor, or as the judicial system terms it, "mitigate my interest", and then maybe file suit against HD for my trouble and expense.  Maybe.  But that's just me.  I never had the patience to sit around waiting for some $200 a week clerk to determine who is at fault.  I feel for you, but I have been very lucky over the years with my Harleys.  Any major failures I have had, have been due to my abuse of the product.  Harleys are all I have ever owned, and the only Motorcycle I will ever own.  I drank the kool-aide when I was 6 years old!  Later--HUBBARD     

[fastfreddy]

this just sux that you have to go thru this kinda BS to get something done, can i ask how many miles on this motor, you the first owner and any photos you can post up??

[easternhotrod]

I bought the bike new last fall it has 4000 kilometres on it (2500 miles)

[grc]

I bought the bike new last fall it has 4000 kilometres on it (2500 miles)

I'm not familiar with Canadian law, but if the bike is well within the factory warranty limits and they refuse to fix obvious defects, you may need to consult an attorney.  Have you spoken directly to a manager at Harley-Davidson, or have you been dealing just with the local dealerships?  Don't assume any dealership is telling you the truth if they claim Harley refused to authorize a warranty repair; get your information directly from the horse's mouth, not the other end.

Jerry

[easternhotrod]

Hey Gerry,
I have talked with the Canadian Harley service rep John White at least 5 times and had it to 4 different dealers with the same song and dance. He would not even authorize any dealer to open it up to find out what was causing the vibration. He said we don't have problems with our cranks anymore. I said the reason you are not replacing cranks is because over the years you have increased the specs to a point that you are not replacing many but the customers bikes are shaking themselves apart. I is outrageous to think that it is normal for a crankshaft to have .002 thousands run out let alone .012. Part of his reasoning for not opening up the engine was that the dealers told him that yes there was a vibration but it was acceptable! Acceptable to whom! sure wasn't acceptable to me. Two service techs at different dealers told me on the sly that Harley would not pay for the inspection if what they found wasn't over there outrageously high run out and wear limits so they told the service rep it was not bad enough to warrant taking it apart because there was a chance they wouldn't get paid for it..
I'm going to talk to the service manager at the dealer I bought the bike from next week and show him the damage on the pistons, cylinders, cam plate and crank.

[ACfixer]

I've been following this thread from the start, terrible. I hope you get some relief soon.

[twinotter]

Sounds like the perfect scenerio for the show Marketplace on CBC Television. They are constantly looking for episodes to produce showing the blatant lack of warranty claims and lemons. Your would be a perfect candidate for the show, and they have gotten some good results from Mfg after the 1 hour shows are aired.
Last use your rights as a Cdn to demand that government pass a LEMON law here like the US has.
You may also want ot contact your local Ombudsman in Ontario. Your dealer will not likely want to fix this, as with no "approval for repair", he would have to do so on his own $$.
As a last resort, have a lawyer contact HD in Milwaukee, not the Cdn version of HD ass kissers. Ask to speak to the CEO of HD!!  fwiw twinotter

[easternhotrod]

Well Guy's here's the latest on the vibration fiasco with my 110.
As I wrote before I had to tear the engine down because Harley refused to because they (don't have problems with their cranks anymore ).
I took the crank to the dealer I bought the bike from and he sent it out to a engine machine shop in Montreal.
I told them I wanted to know what the run out in the V blocks was before they started any work on the crank.
Well, well, low and behold the crank had .009 thousands run out in the V blocks. Max run out in the V blocks is .005.

The dealer called the head honcho service rep in Toronto with the results. He basically said the machine shop wasn't checking it right and wanted them to measure the flywheel run out as well because I could have dropped the crank on the floor and bent it  . They did and the flywheels also had .009 run out so the crank was scissored.

The dealer called the Harley Rep again. This time he admitted that yes the run out spec's would create the vibration I was talking about. Then he told the dealer that the dealer had to get the bike brought in to verify the crank came out of the bike in question and that there was no damage to the bike WTF. 

So I packaged everything up and trailered the bike and all the parts to the dealer so they could inspect it and verify the crank came out of the bike.
 
After almost a week I called them and they said they just got off the phone with Harley and that they will replace the crank
but they will not put in a new cam plate, oil pump, or replace the scored cylinder wall and pistons.

So I guess it's a partial victory!

But wait! the dealer tried to order a new crank and they were out of stock! go figure! So it looks like I won't be getting my bike back for a month to 6 weeks.

So as a side note what do you guy's think of putting a 117 Kit on it to replace the pistons and cylinders. The service guy says the 117 vibrate more than the 110 so he wasn't sure if I would like it.?

[grc]

I would still take all my evidence to an attorney and sue the chit out of Harley for failure to repair warrantable defects in a timely manner, loss of use, and whatever else the attorney can throw in under Canadian law.  And once they finally admitted the crank was out of spec, I'd love to know how the jerk rep could possibly justify not replacing the other components that defective crank damaged.  This rep is either a simple minded robot, totally unethical, or just has no balls and won't stand up to his bosses to do the right thing.  Or perhaps all of the above. 

Jerry