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Author Topic: Harley union...  (Read 1695 times)

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King Glide

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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #15 on: April 02, 2019, 03:18:59 PM »

I have never understood why union workers always want to strike when it’s obvious to anyone who walks into a dealership can see that sales aren’t doing well. The moco is already offering $33 an hour for screwing nuts and bolts together. I could teach a chimpanzee to do that for a stalk of bananas and the quality of work wouldn’t be any worse. Those workers are lucky to have a job as it is and the permanent layoffs are just around the corner.

STUPID IS AS STUPID DOES! at least winter is over and they can get their exercise walking the picket in shorts and Harley t-shirts....
« Last Edit: April 02, 2019, 03:21:58 PM by King Glide »
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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #16 on: April 02, 2019, 06:50:19 PM »

Good googally goobs, they rejected a guaranteed 14% increase over the next 5 years, $2,250 signing bonus, no increase in healthcare costs/coverage and retirement incentives for eligible to retire?  Even with the downturn in motorcycle sales, they got this contract offer.  My, my, my...sounds like a great contract to me but what do I know... :nixweiss:

Looks like the machinist and aerospace union were the smart ones...they accepted it.

Workers need to sign the contract FAST.......

Sales suck, cost are going up for HD....
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Ironhorse

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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #17 on: April 02, 2019, 08:57:28 PM »

Well $33 an hour with a family and today's high cost of living might not go very far. Perhaps it's the old story, ask for the stars and accept the moon. Could be just another tactic.
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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #18 on: April 02, 2019, 09:09:35 PM »

Good googally goobs, they rejected a guaranteed 14% increase over the next 5 years, $2,250 signing bonus, no increase in healthcare costs/coverage and retirement incentives for eligible to retire?  Even with the downturn in motorcycle sales, they got this contract offer.  My, my, my...sounds like a great contract to me but what do I know... :nixweiss:

Looks like the machinist and aerospace union were the smart ones...they accepted it. 

Without looking through it, is there any language for job security? If there's layoffs, who's the first to go? The temp workers or the Union workers?  Big money is good until the cuts come and you're on the outside looking in. Make $33 an hour for a month or two and then you're gone.


Job security is a big sticking point in our contract that expired a year ago. Negotiations are pretty much at a stand still as AT&Greed will not even talk about job security.
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FLSTFI Dave

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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #19 on: April 02, 2019, 09:14:13 PM »

Not really smart. They rejected a new contract.
https://www.jsonline.com/story/money/2019/04/02/steelworkers-reject-five-year-contract-offer-harley-davidson-inc/3339565002/

Wow.  That was rather dumb on their part.  That is a very good wage for York PA.  Average Salary in York PA is 46,500.

Well $33 an hour with a family and today's high cost of living might not go very far. Perhaps it's the old story, ask for the stars and accept the moon. Could be just another tactic.

Actually in York PA is is well above average.   33 an hours is 68K a year with no over time.  Heck a skilled maintenance guy in York averages 45K a year.  So a line person with no skills is not going to take 33 an hour.  Dumb.  When they get laid off they will be lucky to get 17 and hour in York PA.

People in Middle America make way less then those on the coast, but our cost of living is way less.
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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #20 on: April 02, 2019, 09:17:20 PM »

Wow...As a union worker in a different industry. ....I am shocked how out of touch this Union is with  what's happening in the market place especially for this product. 

This attitude will help cut off the very hand that feeds them
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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #21 on: April 03, 2019, 08:47:45 AM »


So far all anyone commenting really knows is what Harley has chosen to say, and of course they are only telling the part that makes them look good.  I'd rather see the details, and I'm guessing those details are what caused the no vote.  The last contract took away much, not just in terms of wages but in terms of benefits and basic rules.  A big issue developed from the temporary part time workers (TPT's) Harley stuffed into that contract.  For those unfamiliar with the TPT craze, this started out many years ago as a way to cover absenteeism and vacations, giving the company a lower cost option than direct hiring of extra workers.  They are paid less, get no benefits to speak of, etc.  However, just like some of the companies in the auto industry Harley borrowed the idea from, they abused the system and kept using TPT's while laying off regular workers.  I'll bet that is one of the union's big issues.

As for the comments about trained monkeys, I always love to hear from uninformed folks with an anti-union axe to grind but no direct experience on the jobs being discussed.  Working on a modern assembly line is no cake walk, and in an age where certain politicians want burger flippers to make at least $15 per hour for a truly low skill job, I would expect semi-skilled and skilled workers to demand significantly more.  As a retired manager in the auto industry, I have first hand experience with modern assembly plants.  When we hired, we had people pre-screened by an outside concern, then we brought in groups of 20 at a time for a three week off-line training and work hardening program.  Once the group was put on the actual assembly line, many quit after the first day or two, and only 2 of the 20 on average managed to stick through the 90 day probationary period.  Not exactly a piece of cake job any monkey could do.

Jerry
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muddypaws

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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #22 on: April 03, 2019, 10:06:52 AM »

I worked for the union at Eastern Airlines and I watched as the union destroyed the company and drove it into the ground. The union encouraged the workers to not do much in a way to control the company and keep more workers then the company really needed. I have no use for a union.
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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #23 on: April 03, 2019, 01:12:45 PM »

I worked for the union at Eastern Airlines and I watched as the union destroyed the company and drove it into the ground. The union encouraged the workers to not do much in a way to control the company and keep more workers then the company really needed. I have no use for a union.

Eastern was destroyed by their union.  Darn shame, used to be a good airline.  That event alone changed a lot of people's opinions on unions in general.  The Air Traffic controllers strike did as well. 

Our economy is doing well, so is the stock market.  HD is not, on either count, and that is where they will negotiate from, sooner or later.
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Enigmatic

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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #24 on: April 03, 2019, 07:42:35 PM »

most people only look at what the company is offering, if you think that's a good offer(not knowing the full language of the contract) you have to wonder what they're taking away. maybe they're proposing longer hours and fewer workers, maybe they want to be able to outsource more work, take away vacations, etc. I always get a chuckle when I hear how unions ruin companies, especially knowing that history shows that this country was strongest during the height of trade unionism. I'll be the first to admit unions aren't perfect(because the members are people), but generally speaking it's poor management that ruins companies not unions. Yearly CEO and executive pay packages can usually pay the average worker for a couple of years but you never about anyone going upstairs and asking them to get by with less, they're just as lucky as the man on the shop floor to have a job, probably luckier! because they can mess up and still get a bonus!


sorry I got off on a tangent, lol what i was trying to say is, there's more to contract negotiations than meets the eye. and that most shops organize because they feel unfairly treated by the company.
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skorch

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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #25 on: April 05, 2019, 10:21:45 AM »

Union strong! The only thing left in this country that keeps middle class alive. I experience people commenting on how stupid the union worker is from stupid uninformed people who have NO clue what is going on. Take a look at the super fat salaries executive folks are getting to destroy companies, including Harley! Go union!even if Harley fades away from stupid management.
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dayne66

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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #26 on: April 05, 2019, 10:30:02 AM »

Union strong! The only thing left in this country that keeps middle class alive. I experience people commenting on how stupid the union worker is from stupid uninformed people who have NO clue what is going on. Take a look at the super fat salaries executive folks are getting to destroy companies, including Harley! Go union!even if Harley fades away from stupid management.
Yep!
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Para Bellum

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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #27 on: April 06, 2019, 12:55:29 AM »

I always get a chuckle when I hear how unions ruin companies, especially knowing that history shows that this country was strongest during the height of trade unionism.


sorry I got off on a tangent, lol what i was trying to say is, there's more to contract negotiations than meets the eye. and that most shops organize because they feel unfairly treated by the company.
Just wondering when the height of trade unionism was?
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iski

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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #28 on: April 06, 2019, 01:36:09 AM »

Just wondering when the height of trade unionism was?

1954
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Re: Harley union...
« Reply #29 on: April 06, 2019, 11:00:49 AM »

1954


Yeap.  It was 2:00 PM on a Tuesday.  Little windy that day.  Overall membership been going down ever since.
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