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[110tHunDer]

Love the way we get our panties in a bunch when downplaying HD status.
That’s exactly why the MOCO can whip, beat and make us write bad checks to buy their $hit.
"Victory is celebrating their 10 year Anniversary."

Ron

No, we "get our panties in a bunch" when someone tries to portray BS as fact.  There's a difference.

[SBB]

Love the way we get our panties in a bunch when downplaying HD status.
That’s exactly why the MOCO can whip, beat and make us write bad checks to buy their $hit.
"Victory is celebrating their 10 year Anniversary."

Ron

Ron
AKA Coppertop 1643

It's interesting your on a CVO Harley forum and you claim Victory is selling more units that Harley.
Even if you claim was accurate why do you think we care? If we did we would probably be on a Victory forum.
It's even more interesting you claim to have spent your money on a SEUC and then proclaim that the Victory bikes are getting better.
I can only assume you are confused and wish you the best in finding the correct path to whatever direction your headed!
Good luck in your endeavors and may you find Victory in your efforts!


SBB

[Fired00d]

Two comments:

One.  I have to say the Victory is a nice motorcycle.  Unlike some of the other "production" companies like Big Dog, the victory bikes have a broader market appeal and can appeal to more then just a fat tire type or touring type, etc.  Although I find the Vision to be a space ship looking thing, I could see a Gold Wing guy going for one if he got POd about them moving production BACK to Japan.  This not to say I agree with the statement about Victory outselling or outperforming HD in any way. I think that was intended to rile up the crowd and is wildly innacurate.

Two.  I am surprised at the animosity I see towards HD from some on this site.  I understand everyone has a right to their opinion and I do not object to them speaking it.  Nor do I post in opposition since when it's a matter of opinion there is no right or wrong.  I am merely surprised that all those who hate these bikes and this company so vehemently don't move on to another brand or at least buy an older stock HD and spend the difference in money to do it the way you want it.  Please do not take this as a blanket ataboy to the MoCo.  I certainly see the problems and have experienced some of them myself.  I think it's atrocious that the ACR and leaky head gaskets on the 110s took so long for the MoCo to acknowledge.  I have posted some comments that are negative towards the MoCo and would like to see many changes made. I can understand why you'd be so angry and please do not take this as criticism of your anger.  But for god's sake, some of these posts are just like name calling.  Let's see how mean and vindictive you can be, and since the MoCo has upset you to that degree, why put yourself through it?  I know that in the past I've had Jobs, Bands, Girfriends, Bands, Cars, Bands, and even some friends (mostly from bands I've played in) that have gotten me that upset.  I've elliminated them from my life.

Ride Safe (And happy)
J-Carr

Amen!!!! Well said.

 
Ride Safe,
Fired00d
 

[Hoist!]

I think I'll chime in on this!

Nope! It's called passion. It's called calling BS on BS when it's apparent that something you love so much, and have based your life on, is screwed with in such obvious fashion because of the almighty profit! Some people will only ride a Harley, no matter what kinda crap they serve you. We fix em! And who says it's not fun redoing things to make it the way you want. You'd do most of it anyway, even if nothing's falling apart! So I'll spend the $$$ to do it my way for I bike I'm keeping forever. Who says you need them for anything more than the bike itself.

But moving on, NOT GONNA HAPPEN! I ride a Harley! I love my bikes and am about as passionate as you can get about them! I wouldn't have their trademark tattooed on my arm if I wasn't! And if the MoCo screws up (as they traditionally do), I'll at least let them know how I feel. No not because I don't like HD, but because I LOVE IT!!!

And Harley banks on that passion! So don't worry. They're big boys, they can take it! They know damn well that "If I have to explain why, you wouldn't understand!" is their bread and butter, and key to their survival and profitably. So when enough people get fed up with them, things might get better!

Hoist!

[JETCVO]

I think I'll chime in on this!

Nope! It's called passion. It's called calling BS on BS when it's apparent that something you love so much, and have based your life on, is screwed with in such obvious fashion because of the almighty profit! Some people will only ride a Harley, no matter what kinda crap they serve you. We fix em! And who says it's not fun redoing things to make it the way you want. You'd do most of it anyway, even if nothing's falling apart! So I'll spend the $$$ to do it my way for I bike I'm keeping forever. Who says you need them for anything more than the bike itself.

But moving on, NOT GONNA HAPPEN! I ride a Harley! I love my bikes and am about as passionate as you can get about them! I wouldn't have their trademark tattooed on my arm if I wasn't! And if the MoCo screws up (as they traditionally do), I'll at least let them know how I feel. No not because I don't like HD, but because I LOVE IT!!!

And Harley banks on that passion! So don't worry. They're big boys, they can take it! They know damn well that "If I have to explain why, you wouldn't understand!" is their bread and butter, and key to their survival and profitably. So when enough people get fed up with them, things might get better!

Hoist!

Well said Hoist!
Thank you,
Ron

[J-Carr]

I think I'll chime in on this!

Nope! It's called passion. It's called calling BS on BS when it's apparent that something you love so much, and have based your life on, is screwed with in such obvious fashion because of the almighty profit! Some people will only ride a Harley, no matter what kinda crap they serve you. We fix em! And who says it's not fun redoing things to make it the way you want. You'd do most of it anyway, even if nothing's falling apart! So I'll spend the $$$ to do it my way for I bike I'm keeping forever. Who says you need them for anything more than the bike itself.

But moving on, NOT GONNA HAPPEN! I ride a Harley! I love my bikes and am about as passionate as you can get about them! I wouldn't have their trademark tattooed on my arm if I wasn't! And if the MoCo screws up (as they traditionally do), I'll at least let them know how I feel. No not because I don't like HD, but because I LOVE IT!!!

And Harley banks on that passion! So don't worry. They're big boys, they can take it! They know damn well that "If I have to explain why, you wouldn't understand!" is their bread and butter, and key to their survival and profitably. So when enough people get fed up with them, things might get better!

Hoist!

Howie,

I agree with you. That's my point.  I've read your posts and for the most point they're constructive criticism with some pointers on one method of getting the satisfaction of something you love.  Do you sometime needle a bit while doing it?  Of course (You're from New York it's bred into you! LOL!!!).   And believe me, I can be a cynical ba$tard at times (I'm origianally from New Jersey, it's bred into me!  LOL!!!). Everyone runs off at the mouth at times.  Remember when you invited me up to join everyone in the Adirondacks but I couldn't be sure I'd have enough money because I was saving up for oil to replace what would leak out?  Passion will do that.  And God Bless you and the rest of us who have that passion.

The difference is when it becomes so overwhelming that all you can do is complain about it.  Or worse yet, manufacture or mis quote statistics to make a statement that is blatently false.  When someone gets so angry and consumed that they start posting irrationally.  Making statements that even someone with about 5 minutes of experience on Google could get the facts to refute, if someones experience with this product has degenerated to that point, it's time to move on for your own health and happiness.

Ride Safe,
J-Carr

[Hoist!]

Howie,

I agree with you. That's my point.  I've read your posts and for the most point they're constructive criticism with some pointers on one method of getting the satisfaction of something you love.  Do you sometime needle a bit while doing it?  Of course (You're from New York it's bred into you! LOL!!!).   And believe me, I can be a cynical ba$tard at times (I'm origianally from New Jersey, it's bred into me!  LOL!!!). Everyone runs off at the mouth at times.  Remember when you invited me up to join everyone in the Adirondacks but I couldn't be sure I'd have enough money because I was saving up for oil to replace what would leak out?  Passion will do that.  And God Bless you and the rest of us who have that passion.

The difference is when it becomes so overwhelming that all you can do is complain about it.  Or worse yet, manufacture or mis quote statistics to make a statement that is blatently false.  When someone gets so angry and consumed that they start posting irrationally.  Making statements that even someone with about 5 minutes of experience on Google could get the facts to refute, if someones experience with this product has degenerated to that point, it's time to move on for your own health and happiness.

Ride Safe,
J-Carr

Now that whole thing I couldn't agree more with. I misread the intent of the last one. Sorry man!

I'm glad ya know where I'm coming from too!

We all do what we have to do, and can afford to do. I feel terrible for the guy that has no option except to stay with the HD network and w.....ty. It's one thing to deal with it out of choice. That decision is ours to make and deal with. The guy who can never afford to go his own direction, and expected HD's best, most reliable bike, is the one who's stuck in a corner. He might not be able to afford an alternative. It can get very frustrating dealing with their BS. I don't mind the bitching or anger over it. We all need to vent sometimes. If it's irrational or untrue, it'll get dismissed or flushed out here pretty quickly. We get to know each other here pretty well, and understand whose info you can rely on, and whose you can't. Fakers and posers don't usually last long with the main participating body. So we basically get along great, look out for each other, and when you finally meet someone you've been talking to for months, you already know them. We're very lucky in that regard. But as they say, don't believe everything you read on the internet either! And only a fool puts up with these ridiculous problems instead of bailing, while they actually hate the product. Like I said earlier, you do that cause you LOVE IT!!!

Hoist!

[skreminegul07]

Besides the disappointment and accompanying anger with these issues, is the time not riding.  Many members here have more than one bike which is my goal as well.  I sold two to get the money to buy the SERK and have regretted it ever since.  Before I put $10K into fixing the SERK, I'll buy another HD or even Victory.  Not passion, practicality.
At least if I had another to ride it wouldn't have been so bad.  It's way too short a season here in NE.

[tennisman]

I am new to the forum but not to cycles (riding since the mid-sixties).  I AM new to HD as an owner (Ultra SE) - I came to HD figuring the new century and the sophistication of engine technology have made most scoots extremely reliable, AND, I hoped HD, while having a 'dated' design, would have modernized it sufficiently to be in the high reliability sector.  So far (only 4000 miles), I am pleased with reliability.  I am coming from (and still own) Kaw Vulcan cruiser (125 cube V-Twin).
On the overall front, I am surprised at some of the lack of sophistication of some HD things, ranging from ergonomics, maintainability, and plain common sense.  BUT, ALL BIKES HAVE THEIR PROS AND CONS.  I admit however I had high expectations from a Ultra SE with the high $$ price tag that came with it.

Some pluses are:
- great wind protection from fairing and lowers - the adjustable deflectors are nice to direct air or block it
- smooth ride at any speed - no annoying vibes, high or low frequency
- cruise control - easy to set, change, and it smoothly adjusts for varying topography
- looks - none better, classic good looks for a touring machine, not plastic or utilitarian
- bells and whistles (except for the nav sys), all systems seem good quality items
- smart security system - nice not to have to fumble with keys
- handling, good at speed in twisties and in parking lots
- heated seat and grips: nice on those cool days
- belt drive is quiet, nice
- engine noise is quieter than expected, hope it stays that way!
- HD sound, now that is signature
- overdrive gear - makes hiway cruising a pleasure, and long downhill grades, too
- CVO bike cover - good fit and stows away well - logo makes me want that paging alarm, though!
- locking kickstand, should be a safety standard on all bikes
- saddlebags and tour pak, handy and good quality (except maybe tour pak hinges - could be beefier)
- stock horn, reasonably loud, better than most bikes

Some minuses:
- idle shake, yeah, yeah, signature HD my butt...gets old, especially in stop/go traffic
- heat - it's time to water-cool; my 125 cube Kaw never overheats me or my passenger in summer stop/go traffic.  And water-cooling would negate complicated and unnecessary Engine Temp managment band-aids
- ergonomics, I'm 5'-8" - even with rear lower shocks, I am still on tip toes; passenger ergos need work, short passenger's calve gets bruised on saddlebag bar; yes, I could change my seat, and loose my and my passenger's heated seat feature!  Also, passenger floorboard is too close to left pipe (melted shoe issue - why not have a heel guard built-in?)
- at this price I don't get a paging alarm?!?  C'mon!!  And the alarm system has no shock sensor??  My other bike has shock, current, and tilt sensing with a pager for $179!!
- Torx screws are crap - what happened to socket head screws???  They don't strip very easily!!  And what's with the lack of using Never-Seez on threads?   
- windshield shoud be adjustable at this price, not necessarily motorized, but adjustable
- bag quarter-turn retainers are not very easy to handle - Leatherlyke retainers are superior
- for a 110 cube motor, it shouldn't need this much clutch slippage to get underway - maybe 1st gear is too tall??
- $12 a quart synthetic lube...a bit pricey
- kickstand,while locking is a plus, allows bike to lean over too far, IMO
- gas cap, hinged wrong way, makes fuel additions cumbersome (why not hinge from the front or swing past 90 degrees to say 120 degrees)
- wired headsets....can you say "Bluetooth"
- who put an oil filter in a cramped spot and then surrounded it with an oil cooler and hoses?? 

[JETCVO]

Now that whole thing I couldn't agree more with. I misread the intent of the last one. Sorry man!

I'm glad ya know where I'm coming from too!

We all do what we have to do, and can afford to do. I feel terrible for the guy that has no option except to stay with the HD network and w.....ty. It's one thing to deal with it out of choice. That decision is ours to make and deal with. The guy who can never afford to go his own direction, and expected HD's best, most reliable bike, is the one who's stuck in a corner. He might not be able to afford an alternative. It can get very frustrating dealing with their BS. I don't mind the bitching or anger over it. We all need to vent sometimes. If it's irrational or untrue, it'll get dismissed or flushed out here pretty quickly. We get to know each other here pretty well, and understand whose info you can rely on, and whose you can't. Fakers and posers don't usually last long with the main participating body. So we basically get along great, look out for each other, and when you finally meet someone you've been talking to for months, you already know them. We're very lucky in that regard. But as they say, don't believe everything you read on the internet either! And only a fool puts up with these ridiculous problems instead of bailing, while they actually hate the product. Like I said earlier, you do that cause you LOVE IT!!!

Hoist!

Hoist,

Again, thank you for the insightful replies and yes, I certainly took offense to SBB’s stinging comments. I have a readied retort in the offering, but thought better about firing back without a deep breath. It’s not my intention to cause upset or controversy with individuals who may also be trying to overcome HD’s engineering and quality issues. It was also noted that the Victory sales report issues was removed when my intent played wrong in writing.

The fact is my patience is running thin with manufacturers who just do not appreciate their customers, dealers and only offer lip service to problems. I spent too many years with Cessna Aircraft enduring their buffoonery in regard to customer/dealer complaints and now the fuse is blunted.

Also, I’m certainly not confused as stated by SBB. My relationship with Harley runs deep and started before I could walk. My Dad introduced the tradition after WWII and they have been a part of my DNA ever since. 

From my viewpoint, we have an N8 right to bitch especially when big money crosses the table to purchase the “Flag Ship” of HD and things aren’t right. They seem to have the money to do projects out of country, but not properly take care of business at home.

Kind regards.
Ron

[iski]

Well, there is still not any chance in hell that Harley is even considering anything like a "CVO CS hotline."

But they do make CVO engines that run hot hot hot, so maybe that's as much as we can expect, currently.

[Hoist!]

Well, there is still not any chance in hell that Harley is even considering anything like a "CVO CS hotline."

But they do make CVO engines that run hot hot hot, so maybe that's as much as we can expect, currently.

Mike, ya mean they're not giving me that direct hot line to Willie G like they promised!!!

Man, and up til now, I believed EVERYTHING they ever told me!!!

Hoist!

[iski]

Mike, ya mean they're not giving me that direct hot line to Willie G like they promised!!!

Man, and up til now, I believed EVERYTHING they ever told me!!!

Hoist!

Howie,

I believe when you put a check down on a HD as a deposit, they will cash that sucker the next day.  I believe each year HD will do it's damn best to obsolete as much of the previous years product as they can imagine.  I also believe I love riding/working on my HD scoots & when I cannot ride 'em I get pissed for whatever the reason.  I believe Willie G is a GD lucky SOB to have been born a Davidson.  I believe many, many people will keep buying HD bikes since lots of folks love them as much was we do.

But I don't believe there will be any CVO hotline to anything, anytime, anywhere, unless Neal decides to add one on this forum.  And I hope he doesn't do that since then we could link to live biatchin' & it would give me a headache.   

And that is what I believe. 

Oh yeah, I also believe I would like to see some pics of Jessica Alba's nekkid gazongabongas.     

Mike

[SBB]

Well I glad Ron M wasn't confused as to the intent of my post as to inaccuracies of his post.

As for the rest of his bla, bla, bla post about,

It’s not my intention to cause upset or controversy with individuals who may also be trying to overcome HD’s engineering and quality issues.

People get upset about everything, but when they come to a Harley forum that specializes in the CVO-Screaming Eagles and proceed to blast everyone with untruths I will respond.

The only thing I have to overcome is when people just blather on and whine and not never do anything about the issue.

Throwing Hoist into the mix is fine but at least Hoist stepped up and resolved his problem.

The right to bitch and whine is one thing but both get old and boring when it's done not to resolve an issue but to just hear one's self talk.


SBB


 

[JETCVO]

Well I glad Ron M wasn't confused as to the intent of my post as to inaccuracies of his post.

As for the rest of his bla, bla, bla post about,

People get upset about everything, but when they come to a Harley forum that specializes in the CVO-Screaming Eagles and proceed to blast everyone with untruths I will respond.

The only thing I have to overcome is when people just blather on and whine and not never do anything about the issue.

Throwing Hoist into the mix is fine but at least Hoist stepped up and resolved his problem.

The right to bitch and whine is one thing but both get old and boring when it's done not to resolve an issue but to just hear one's self talk.


SBB


 

Hi SBB,
AKA Silver-Black

You’re a piece of work.
It appears you have an ’09 on order? May you not get a rusty bucket dropped in your well!

I surmise you’re still blogging the forum for the brotherhood of it all or work for HD. Certainly not because you have unresolved bike issues?

Rest assured SBB, in regards to your clever rhetorical Victory pun, the definition of Victory is to gain the upper hand and conquest. Mine is to get my new SE fixed and one way or the other I will.

For sure, it won’t be due anything you bring to the table.

In closing, Coppertop is the bike; I use my name not initials.

Ron