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[mnrider]

Ok so I ordered my bike should be here mid March. The dealer went over some things to think about. They offered the 2+5 year ESP for $1699 and the same time frame on the rim and tire coverage for $1999. So seven years of "bumper to bumper coverage" they said it is the same as the warranty you get for two years just extended. Has anyone had to use it if so what is not covered? I tried looking for current info on it and found nothing.

[Chuck Pryor]

It can easily pay for itself... Easily.

[15CVOSG]

The new contracts are now V-series contracts...some coverages are changed...deductibles are a little higher...price on 7 year no tire and wheel is good ...but with tire and wheel you should get a little better say $1,900 ...kutter harley is a good place to check on pricing...you can buy the extended from any harley dealer...

[mnrider]

Does the tire/rim pay for labor if you have a problem? The dealer said no deductibles on tire/rim and I forgot to ask about deductible on the ESP.

[Beak Boater]

On my ESP it pays for labor, I have been told that they are not all the same. But if your tire is worn below 2/32 left, they pay for nothing on your tires. So what ever happens to your tires, hope it happens before 3/32 of rubber is left.

[mnrider]

Good to know.

[Fireguy]

I got the extended warranty making it a 7 year unlimited milage. I would think it would be well worth it especially with the new electronics. Now just ride the crap out of it and enjoy without worrying about issues.

[OBB]

I bought mine from Kutter's for 20% off. Some dealers have a sign up in the service area that the ESP will pay for repairs but not diagnostics. Haven't had to use mine yet so I can't confirm that.

[mark]

To each his own on ESPs, but these are offered because they are very profitable for the dealers.  I'm always humored by salespersons (both auto and motorcycles) who tell you how good their product is when they are convincing you to buy.  Once you decide to purchase, they tell you their chit will probably break and you should buy one of their insurance policies.

[spada84]

I bought the 5 year - wish I bought the 7.

So far - I new rear tire, $350
New clutch including hydraulics  $1200
New motor (rebuild) $North of 6K
New heated seat. $900+

I'll buy on the next one too.  But realize, I ride 20K/year.  I might not buy if I was buying garage bling.  In my case, something like a Breakout.  That would only get a few thousand miles per year, and might not be worth it for me.

[grc]

My advice is the same as it would be for any service contract purchase.  Have them give you a complete copy of the actual contract that details what is covered, what isn't covered, what the deductible is and how it's applied (per item, per service visit, etc.).  Right off the top, unless something has changed for 2014 the ESP DOES NOT cover everything just like warranty.  Things like paint, chrome, etc. are not covered for instance.  The actual contract should give you the real scoop, versus the BS you will get from a salesman.

Also, be very aware of the gotcha's.  Modifications can void the contract.  Use of nonstandard parts can void the contract.  There are plenty of people on this and other forums who can tell you how the ESP folks refused to cover repairs due to mods, even when the mods had nothing to do with the failure in question.

Jerry

[Supershooter]

The more miles you ride, the more value it provides, 5000 miles a year or less, may not be worth the cost, def not the wheel and tire. I bought both on my 2010 but wouldn't have brought the wheel and tire in hind sight. I have used the ESP on a oil consumption issue, $50 copayment each time it goes in the shop for warranty/ESP issues.
Supershooter

[ChopperPilot]

I purchased the 5yr extended warranty plan, just not the wheel and tire plan.  Chances are you will come out ahead in the long run.

[grc]

I purchased the 5yr extended warranty plan, just not the wheel and tire plan.  Chances are you will come out ahead in the long run.

I'm not sure how you can say that, since you don't know how much the bike will actually be ridden and under what conditions.  Actually, the chances (odds) are that most people will not come out ahead.  The ESP is very profitable for H-D, the dealership, and the actual ESP company.  If most policy holders "came out ahead", then there would be no profits.  This is the case with all such service contracts, no matter what product they cover (TV, car, bike, whatever).

Jerry

[FLHTCUSE7]

It's American union labor, get the warranty. 

[smkymtnboy]

no, matter what you are told,only time will tell if the warranty is worth the price!!!

[dartman]

Ok so I ordered my bike should be here mid March. The dealer went over some things to think about. They offered the 2+5 year ESP for $1699 and the same time frame on the rim and tire coverage for $1999. So seven years of "bumper to bumper coverage" they said it is the same as the warranty you get for two years just extended. Has anyone had to use it if so what is not covered? I tried looking for current info on it and found nothing.

Some benefit from them but the majority do not, if the odds were in your favor they would not be marketing them.

[mnrider]

I think I'm going to take the ESP and see what the out come is down the road. I do agree dealers are out to make money and ESPs are very profitable for the dealers. I also think better safe then sorry. I'm still on the fence when it comes to the tire/rim coverage.

[timo482]

my esp expired a couple months ago - i can't believe how fast time has flown.

ended up with new rings, new header pipes & some other bits and pieces - in the shop two times over all that time. [well, plus quite a few tires]

when its all said and done i would have been ahead without the esp, IF i put the cash in savings and tapped it when something broke.

oh well live and learn

to

[2018_FLTRXSE]

If you ride it.. take the ESP + tire and wheel.

On the wife's 11 Road King we did not.. in three years less that 4K...

On my '12 FLTRXSE... 3 tires, one front wheel, three radio replacements... and so on... Consider I ride this everyday in all weather (no snow) and the bike sits in an open lot at work with no cover.

Well worth it.... IMHO... I replaced 4 tires. They covered three... the fourth was a little too far gone and it didnt have any debris in it...

[Billy]

 I think mileage is the key word here. I f you ride enough the tire and wheel will pay for them self. I had 2 new tire from damage. The extended warranty  saved me 9000.00 over the extra five years.   It was an 07 SERK . They were the worst of the bikes it looks like but I still bought the ESPO fort he 14 SERK. I put about 12000 miles a year and plan on more as I age I hope.    Billy

[grc]

It's American union labor, get the warranty. 

I'd rather have American union labor any day versus the cheap crap Chinese labor involved in many of the cheap crap parts Harley installs on their bikes and sells in their accessory and motor clothes boutiques.  And the vast majority of the failures on the bikes are not related to the American assembly labor, but rather the lousy design work and lousy purchased part quality and excessive cost cutting by management.

Jerry

[dayne66]

I'd rather have American union labor any day versus the cheap crap Chinese labor involved in many of the cheap crap parts Harley installs on their bikes and sells in their accessory and motor clothes boutiques.  And the vast majority of the failures on the bikes are not related to the American assembly labor, but rather the lousy design work and lousy purchased part quality and excessive cost cutting by management.

Jerry

Very true, Brother!

[greglyon]

You will note that ESP for cars have both a time limit and mileage limit.  The actuaries know they can get hurt
if they allow unlimited mileage in their plans.  Whoever said the number of miles you ride dictates whether the ESP makes financial sense struck the nail on the head!  What that number is, who knows?   

[smkymtnboy]

I think I'm going to take the ESP and see what the out come is down the road. I do agree dealers are out to make money and ESPs are very profitable for the dealers. I also think better safe then sorry. I'm still on the fence when it comes to the tire/rim coverage.

if you ride very often,you probably made the right choice and only time will tell. if, it helps you sleep a little better then its probably a good choice for you. i bought it and the verdict is still out, but i do ride whenever and wherever when i can with a little more confidence and security. only you know if the esp is worth it to your situation. congrats on the coming of a new ride!

[mark]

Every time someone posts a question about getting an ESP, there's always the two sides that emerge: the pro-ESP and anti-ESP crowd.  We read many antidotal responses in which riders credit the ESP with saving them money.  However, logic dictates there is a much larger number of owners that never come close to breaking even.

If buying an ESP gives you comfort and piece of mind, then buy it, you'll ride with ease.  

[ole bill]

If you trade every  2 years skip it, if you ride a lot of miles, and you need to feel content, then buy it.

[CaptKaos]

I took the 5 yr + tire and wheel have not had to use it yet but another comment I had from the dealer was about trade in. If you have the ESP the bike can be more desirable if there is time left on the ESP vs none.

[Badger Mike]

Crank went out on my 2010 w/ 15,000 miles on it.  Had the ESP from the dealer, and found out the following:

1.  The warranty company is CNA Warranty, it is not a Harley Davidson program that the dealer is selling you.
2.  Shop rates are negotiated in the contract, so the dealer loses $ on the work, and if you go with an independent shop, they will get screwed on the reimbursement from CNA.
3.  They are really looking for any engine modifications, including tuners, which ALL void the warranty by contract, even the HD Tuner.
4.  I would still buy the warranty, as it is better than nothing and covers an extensive amount of other things on the bike.

[mnrider]

Mike did you have anything done to the bike other then stock?

[FlaHeatWave]

I was a big fan of the ESP until they denied a claim on the '09 SERG because of a SE Stage III Kit. 'Have since cancelled on the '09 (after a crank and 2 rear tires) 'Still have ESP on the bone stock '05 SEEG though.

Wait until you are almost out of the factory warranty before you purchase the ESP, otherwise you get 2 years of 'overlap'.

I recommend the tire & wheel. (no deductible).

[Badger Mike]

Oh yeah!  We had to be very creative before the adjuster could come out and view the motor. 

[mnrider]

At this point I just want a great exhaust system and that's it. So I need to figure out what is not going to void anything.

[ultrafxr]

At this point I just want a great exhaust system and that's it. So I need to figure out what is not going to void anything.

Anything other than a street legal H-D muffler will void it for sure if they catch it.

[ultrafxr]

I can certainly see 'both' sides of the ESP discussion and even 'our' side vs ESP's side regard mods.  We know that a stage one with a proper tune will certainly do nothing in and of itself to cause the motor to fail and we sure don't think we should be denied coverage for that or pulling a trailer, etc.  But ESP has agreed to cover repairs for failure of components as they come from the factory.  If they allow some mods where do they draw the line?  I've never had a claim denied (major ones like total motor replacement) even though I had a stage one mod.  Maybe I was lucky as I understand the ESP inspectors are taking a real hard line now.  That is the primary reason my 2012 is bone stock as I don't want to give them any excuse to deny a potential future claim.

And yes, most folks 'lose out' or the ESP company would not be able to make a profit.  But if you are like me and ride a lot of miles and keep your bike for several years it will most likely pay for itself imo.  I've had ESP on three bikes and they have all paid for themselves many times over.  Just my anecdotal experience.

[Badger Mike]

Agreed, but the MOCO should make it clear that dealers should inform people when they sell the warranty that ANY modifications may void the warranty.  Mine certainly didn't, and from the sound of it most don't.  It is clear however that you read the warranty, it is very clear what voids the warranty.  CNA is really taking a hard line on this, especially with the engine.  Their most frequent claim on the 110 motor is the crank, so they are doing everything they can to look for abnormalities on any bike that is making a claim.

In the end, buyer beware.

[FLTRCVO]

I think mileage is the key word here. I f you ride enough the tire and wheel will pay for them self. I had 2 new tire from damage. The extended warranty  saved me 9000.00 over the extra five years.   It was an 07 SERK . They were the worst of the bikes it looks like but I still bought the ESPO fort he 14 SERK. I put about 12000 miles a year and plan on more as I age I hope.    Billy

I agree my 2007 SERK was a disaster and required 5 crate motors from the Motor Company within 15 months.

[Badger Mike]

...and then you went with a S&S 

[ktorian]

I bought the ESP with my 2014 Limited.   I was initially planning to have the dealer install Rineharts and a super tuner, but I changed my mind after learning it would void the warranty. It says so in the catalog and i confirmed it on the phone to Milwaukee. The dealer tried hard to convince me that they would look out for me, but I'd rather be safe than sorry.  I went with Street Cannons and a download and couldn't be happier.  All street legal and warranty intact. The catalog clearly indicated what parts are street legal as well as what parts will or won't void the warranty.

[screem]

It's American union labor, get the warranty. 

Organized labor built this country and raised the standard of living.....thanks to all my Union Brothers 

[grc]

I bought the ESP with my 2014 Limited.   I was initially planning to have the dealer install Rineharts and a super tuner, but I changed my mind after learning it would void the warranty. It says so in the catalog and i confirmed it on the phone to Milwaukee. The dealer tried hard to convince me that they would look out for me, but I'd rather be safe than sorry.  I went with Street Cannons and a download and couldn't be happier.  All street legal and warranty intact. The catalog clearly indicated what parts are street legal as well as what parts will or won't void the warranty.

All dealers try to convince people they will "look out for them", but I don't remember hearing about any that would put it in writing and have the dealer principal sign it.  Harley sells illegal stuff to the dealers for a profit, the dealers turn around and sell the illegal stuff to customers for a profit, and then Harley stiffs the customers by voiding the warranty after the customer buys the BS and the lies.  It's hard to understand why some folks like me don't have much use for Harley management, isn't it?

I think the proper way to handle this is for the EPA to bust the butts of both Harley and the dealers for selling illegal emission system defeat devices to people who use their bikes on public roads.  If Harley had ever been treated the same way the auto companies were concerning this subject, you wouldn't see SEPST's being sold openly at every dealership to every non-racer street bike rider who walks in the door.  The fines, if EPA were to enforce the law, would put most dealers out of business and put a world of hurt on H-D as well.  Enforcement would have given H-D the incentive to put out a product that ran well right off the showroom floor, and saved the average customer a bunch of money on tuning devices that made up a big part of the "Harley Tax" everyone had to pay to make their new bike run worth a chit. 

Jerry

[Beak Boater]

Interesting take on the ESP issue. Never really looked at it that way.....but your are right.

[05Train]

Interesting take on the ESP issue. Never really looked at it that way.....but your are right.

No kidding.

That's a damn fine post Jerry.

[GC_Super]

Anybody remember the old commercials about if E.F. Hutton talks, everybody listens ? I know I'm showing my age here.  Around here, if Jerry talks, everybody listens. No bullchit, just the truth. 

As to the ESP, I don't buy them on anything, never.

[ultrarider123]

I'll chime in on this one.....Jerry does not like the ESP.  He has valid points and I have to agree with him.  As others have stated, however, they were very glad they had the ESP and per their issues, ESP was a good purchase for them.

Whether it's a garage queen or a cross country jugggernaut, it all boils down to betting.  You hope the ESP is never used but you put the coins in the slot anyway.  Either way, the house wins.  If you do use your ESP and it comes in handy, you pat yourself on the back because you made that purchase.  The house still wins, however, because they took your money and invested it to make more.  What little claim you may have had is a drop in the bucket compared to what they made while they had your money.  Plus, at the end of the contract, it's all theirs.  But for every ESP claim, there are probably 10-15 policies never used.  House wins again.  Otherwise, why sell the darn insurance in the first place?  CNA (or any other firm for that matter) is NOT in the business to lose money.

Me?  I have purchased the ESP in the past (last time was on the 1997 Ultra....never used it).  Have not since and did not when I bought Ginger.  Thought about it....and am considering it as my factory warranty is out end of March this year just because of my fear the 110 gremlins that MANY of our other brothers/sisters have encountered.  However, consider this as I am.  If I take that same $1,500 to $1,900 and put it in the bank for "future" problems, it will be drawing me interest (what little it will) and NOT the insurance company.  Yep, I may still have to use it plus more if there are major problems but it's in the bank, not the hands of the insurance company.  At the end of 3, 4 or 5 years and I don't use it, it's still my money.  Plus, I can modify to my hearts content after the warranty goes out and not worry about any denied claims....

Just some thoughts to ponder upon this lovely Wednesday afternoon....

[ultrarider123]

I bought the ESP with my 2014 Limited.   I was initially planning to have the dealer install Rineharts and a super tuner, but I changed my mind after learning it would void the warranty. It says so in the catalog and i confirmed it on the phone to Milwaukee. The dealer tried hard to convince me that they would look out for me, but I'd rather be safe than sorry.  I went with Street Cannons and a download and couldn't be happier.  All street legal and warranty intact. The catalog clearly indicated what parts are street legal as well as what parts will or won't void the warranty.

One other thing concerning the statement your dealer made......no matter how you feel about that dealer, NEVER, NEVER, NEVER, NEVER (did I say that enough)....NEVER trust one that makes this comment and I don't care how long you've known them.  If you don't get outside their "realm" of coverage (more than 50 miles), this could possibly work however I still wouldn't trust it as far as I could throw my bike.
If you take your bike on trips where you get outside their "area", ain't no way this works.  Sales pitch all the way......just something to ponder on again....

[Tru-Blu]

Very good points, Haird.  I'm deliberating that myself, but have quite a bit of time before reaching a decision (factory warranty on Saphira doesn't run out until Sept. 2015).  I won't be putting a ton of miles on baby for the first few years due to my existing schedule (working full-time and going back to school full-time right now).  That actually makes it harder because I won't have as much of an opportunity for things to rise to the surface from usage.

[Badger Mike]

Having experienced this, and then having an opportunity to speak with the President of CNA Warranty Company (I'm an Insurance Agent and know the CEO of CNA) about my experience on this, I still believe I would purchase the warranty on the bike.  I agree with much of what has been said, and like I told CNA's President, I have several concerns about the contract and enforcing the contract given the relationship with the dealers that everyone knows is going on.  It seems counter intuitive, but in my case, even with the modifications, I was able to get coverage and will basically pay for my new S&S motor after selling the rebuilt 110 this spring.  So using the gambling analogy, is it worth the $ to get some coverage, or keeping the money and having no coverage?  That's what makes gambling fun

Harley is not the culprit and CNA is not the culprit, if that were the case, then I wouldn't have the same decision to make on my Ford F250, BMW, Nissan, Mastercraft, Ski Doo's, Sea Doo's, and Yamaha!  Stuff breaks, and you have to decide on how you want to deal with it.  My concerns earlier, and my discussion with CNA, was that the Dealer needs to do a better job of helping the consumer understand what voids the warranty, and how and where the warranty provides coverage (see adding a plow to your Ford truck), and then let the consumer decide.  Ford doesn't make bad trucks, and BMW makes awesome cars; they just have to draw the line somewhere.

Bottom line is that the warranty is a good deal if you use it, and not a good deal if you don't or modify your bike to the point where it voids the warranty.  Everyone has to figure that out on their own.

[mnrider]

All I want is a full exhaust system that sounds great. But having to tap into the ECM to tune the bike could screw me. Does all electrical run through the ECM? If so now that opens me up for void coverage on electrical.

[mark]

One other thing concerning the statement your dealer made......no matter how you feel about that dealer, NEVER, NEVER, NEVER, NEVER (did I say that enough)....NEVER trust one that makes this comment and I don't care how long you've known them.  If you don't get outside their "realm" of coverage (more than 50 miles), this could possibly work however I still wouldn't trust it as far as I could throw my bike.
If you take your bike on trips where you get outside their "area", ain't no way this works.  Sales pitch all the way......just something to ponder on again....

Haird's right.  If it's not on paper, it isn't worth a bucket of warm spit.  All those verbal promises...useless.  Ask yourself this: is the guy who told you that even going to be working there in 2 yrs?  Will the dealership even be owned by the same person?  Even if the dealership made verbal promises, do you really want to go thru the heartache and aggravation of getting caught between the MoCo, the dealer, and CNA if you have a claim?

[mnrider]

I went to the dealer tonight and wanted the fine print. They have me a blank contract with all the info. I will go over it tonight. They told me it is a Harley warranty.

[timo482]

its not a warranty, its a service contract.

and its paid for by a third party

and non hd shops can do esp work - a few non hd shops specialize in that sort of work

there is a world of difference between a warranty and a service contract - there are laws about warranties - service contracts are just contracts - basically the esp boils down to this:  i agree to leave my bike as is, factory stone stock, change the oil and ride it - you , hd esp, agree to fix anything that goes wrong.

[roadking71865]

All I want is a full exhaust system that sounds great. But having to tap into the ECM to tune the bike could screw me. Does all electrical run through the ECM? If so now that opens me up for void coverage on electrical.

I had my bike tuned 500 miles after I got it with a Fullsac system.  I just had the ECM, security module and heated grips replaced because it was shorting out.  All covered under ESP except the $50 deductible.

[mnrider]

I had my bike tuned 500 miles after I got it with a Fullsac system.  I just had the ECM, security module and heated grips replaced because it was shorting out.  All covered under ESP except the $50 deductible.

Good to know. At this point I think I'm moving foreword with the exhaust system idea and getting the ESP. Only time will tell what comes of it all. All I know is I want my bike the way I want it and if on the off chance something happens well so be it.

[GC_Super]

Good to know. At this point I think I'm moving foreword with the exhaust system idea and getting the ESP. Only time will tell what comes of it all. All I know is I want my bike the way I want it and if on the off chance something happens well so be it.

If all you want is an exhaust sytem and no concerns on the warranty, then just have the dealer use the street legal tuner for a stage one tune. But, if you ever decide to do other mods that tuner wil have to be replaced.

[mnrider]

That was my thinking at first. For the extra $ I can have the pro tuner and then down the road if I want more done I'm ready.

[RayG]

Jerry and others often make people aware of the difference in the ESP.  Just prior to purchasing my bike (08) I got a tour of the service area from the SM and was told don't worry about a thing we will take good care of you.  He even went on to say they will cover anything they sell and install regardless of policies.  Some dealers are better than others but most get amnesia.  Some of you may remember a photo I posted of all the metal stuck on the primary magnet.  I was told that it was normal and common for a bike with high mileage.  It was banging loudly at start up & didn't shift as smoothly as before.  I pleaded with them to take a look inside but 3 dealers said if we don't find anything really substantial we will have to charge you and it won't be cheap.  The SM that told me he would take care of me told me that if he could just see the part he would cover it but other than that he strongly suggested that I ride it hard until it completely failed and they would get a new motor installed for me.  I didn't think that was the way to go for me. I asked him if I brought in the part's would he do the repairs, he said I don't usually do this but if you get it the parts here tomorrow I will see what I could do.  So the next day I brought in a badly stripped clutch basket thinking he would live up to his word but he just got angry and he told me you took it off now you own it!  Again nothing in writing,  the metal that came off the clutch basket damaged about everything in the primary so it was a new clutch basket, compensator, adjusting chain, etc. on my dime.  I'm just guessing here but I'm pretty sure the early 110's were very problematic compared to the newer ones.  Many of us have been deceived on numerous occasions, sold products that were supposed to solve the issues,  poor labor and other sub standard methods of running a business.  If you plan to ride it hard or rack up the miles and lack the time or skill to do the maintenance & repairs it may be worth it for you.  My story has nothing special or unusual about it, many have been forced to deal with much worse.  I was not an educated owner, I relied on their word and did not check my policy or get things in writing.   

Words to follow from the good book,  "You shall not steal, nor deal falsely nor lie to one another"  When I was younger I was guilty of breaking that statement, now I do my best to conform to those words. 
There is a lot of "dealing falsely" between the Dealerships that's for sure.

Not many forums have the people that take the time & effort to give you all the info you need to make a good decision,  I wish I had heard about this site before I got into so much turmoil.       

[Freddie_ray]

Although I don't own a CVO I ride a 2012 Ultra Limited. When I purchased it 2 years ago I purchased the Tire & Wheel warranty along with the 3 year service plan. At 15000 my tires are at 4/32 so no replacement as yet, but I've not paid for service yet. I have 1 more year left. next month my 2 year factory warranty expires and the service writer asked if I were interested in the extended. I'm still up in the air about it. I think I will obtain a pre paid CC and put money on it every month, that way should i have a breakdown I'll pay for it with the CC.I've change the exhaust and have a TTS on it now but plan to switch over to FulSac and other mufflers. I love the HD brand, but I would never trust Harley concerning any warranty issues where parts have been changed on the bike. The MoCo is no better than a cracked out whore on the street corner.  

[mnrider]

I am very grateful for everyone responding to this. You have all helped me in a big way. This is my first Harley, I've been riding the same bike now for years and it was a Yamaha. So for me to be buying my first new bike I just want to make as few bad decisions as possible. I'm not even 30 yet so I'm a newbie to buying new. I have a lot to learn in the way of dealing.   

[rayz1951]

I get it for peace of mind, if anything. 

[iski]

The decision to purchase an ESP is an individual one.  Know some who have never used it, others who used it a lot.

Have had 3 of these.  All 3 bikes MINIMUM Race Tuner, breather, non HD pipes. Not one issue regarding a denial for mods, but others have from what I read.

#1 On the 02 RK did a little better than break even.  Bought 3 extra years for total of 5.

#2 On my 07 SEULTRA which also had SE cams, high comp pistons I used it too many times to count.  Was about $1500 ahead on it when I traded it for my 10.  Got a refund on the ESP of $1200 since had a few years left.  

#3 On my 2010 SEULTRA got the 5+ years.  Am about $300 ahead with 3 years left on it.  Recently had lifters, front wheel bearings, and a rotor replaced.  Cost was $50 for all, except upgraded to SE lifters (paid difference only on parts) since stock are crap.  

One reason I buy the ESP is that there are so many internal crap parts - like the compensator - plus the well documented electrical glitches on an Ultra - figure since I ride a fair number of miles odds are in my favor to break even or better.  A lot of folks think a CVO motor has SE (better) internals but they do not.

I do not buy ext. warrantys or service contracts on anything else - only HD.  If you only plan to ride a few miles, probably no reason to get one.  If you ride a lot, maybe.  For me the odds are way better than blackjack, historically.

[2018_FLTRXSE]

I know that locally the adjusters look for anything "non-factory" specifically pipes and piggyback tuners.

TTS makes that easy... and fullsac's pipe under stock shields is perfect for that.

[hdaliaconis]

I'd rather have American union labor any day versus the cheap crap Chinese labor involved in many of the cheap crap parts Harley installs on their bikes and sells in their accessory and motor clothes boutiques.  And the vast majority of the failures on the bikes are not related to the American assembly labor, but rather the lousy design work and lousy purchased part quality and excessive cost cutting by management.

Jerry

Never belonged to a union but support the American Labor Movement.  Would rather have a product built in this country even if some items come from overseas!