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[Hoist!]

Yeah, what Binx said! Thank's again Q family!

Further Today's Update:

I'm going home now to check the spark plug condition and check the TQ on the outside headbolts. If they're already set at 40 ft-lbs, game over. If they're only at HD spec of 25, I'm cranking them, 5 lbs at a time, up to 40. I'll take it easy and salvage the MV. Trip. Either way, this bottom end has been torqued too many times to be comfortable keeping these cases. I'm ordering a set of Timkin S&S cases and S&S flywheels, and doing the entire engine over, whether now, or later in the season. I'll savage as much of the top end as I can, and replace anything that needs to then to. A good friend has a shop and has been doing motors, including mine, for over 20 years. What the hell was I thinking letting HD do it, just to save W.....ty labor $$, with all the money I've spent in parts. That one's on me. Shame on me for thinking this would be OK in the first place. Now it's time to do this right! Vern will do my engine from scratch now. And do it properly, with the right parts.

These horror stories are getting worse and worse. I was waiting to hear of someone getting killed on one of these, and just saw that this morning in another thread. Another god damn shame. HD finally needs to be called to task on this now. If there is a class action lawsuit, I'll be the first to sign up. But that aside, it's time to take matters further into my on hands, and get a strong, reliable, safe engine in Cybil. The chopper gods are never wrong, and they appear to continue to warn me of the impending doom due to HD's lack of caring enough to build us a safe bike. I'm grateful to them that they let Binx and I live to see another day at this point. I will not push my luck any further. But, listen up, HD needs to pay for making us their Guinea Pigs with this, and risking our lives on these bikes everyday!!!

Hoist!

[Twolanerider]

Further Today's Update:

Howie, can certainly understand all the frustration that goes along with seemingly never knocking it out of the park; no matter how hard you try.  Seems like this latest effort has to be the one changes everything from "one more time" to "one last time." 

Those new Axtell jugs and the rest of that very stout top end should still be very happy.  You needed more winter projects anyway.  It's going to snow a lot this year !

[Hoist!]

Howie, can certainly understand all the frustration that goes along with seemingly never knocking it out of the park; no matter how hard you try.  Seems like this latest effort has to be the one changes everything from "one more time" to "one last time." 

Those new Axtell jugs and the rest of that very stout top end should still be very happy.  You needed more winter projects anyway.  It's going to snow a lot this year !

Absolutely, positively, 100% Don. Enough is enough. The gloves are off now. Time to take this much more seriously than I ever thought would be necessary. I'll check the TQ later, and let ya'll know whether we can even salvage MV. But I need this to be right, so I can stop pissing good $$$ down the toilet, and get the bike I've always wanted, to run great, all the time, and stop worrying about what's gonna go next!

Hoist!

[SBB]

Howie

You are riding a grenade.
Sorry if you don't like me saying that but based on your own post below I think you should rethink riding cybal 2000 miles,

Either way, this bottom end has been torqued too many times to be comfortable keeping these cases.

What the hell was I thinking letting HD do it, just to save W.....ty labor $$, with all the money I've spent in parts. That one's on me. Shame on me for thinking this would be OK in the first place. Now it's time to do this right!

These horror stories are getting worse and worse. I was waiting to hear of someone getting killed on one of these, and just saw that this morning in another thread.

I will not push my luck any further.

that he had major attitude issues with both of them when he found out he'd have to do more than just reassembling the engine. He wanted to treat it as "bolt-on HD parts build", as opposed to a custom engine build. Bitching about all the clearancing required, necessary adjustments, etc. There's no place for a bad attitude when assembling a custom motor. So that lack of proper attention led to a problem that surfaced by Fri, with less than 200 miles on it, and the engine never taken over 3000 RPM.

With the parts we used, this is only possible by not assembling it properly and rushing the reassembly.

This occurs when cold and is getting a little worse after each ride. It seals up after getting heated up, after all the metal expands to operating temp. The bike is running hotter too, and I believe that's because it's probably a little leaner due to the air leak. Oilt temp's gotten as high as 246 deg now.

After making the repair, I'll still be real nervous about how this motor was reassembled.

Howie
The above are quotes from you, no changes, no editing.
We all know how you ride.
Are you going to put your wife on the back of a bike like you described above and travel 2000 miles and hope all is well? Just like the piston balancing, get it done right this time and there will be plenty of Maggie Valley's, Sedona's, Nelson's to attend in the future. There is only one Binx and thank God there is only one you, so don't become a statistic or memory in the 110 H/D issue.

Whatever you decide I wish you the best of luck!

S
  /
    B

 

[110tHunDer]

 
So, we were right to question the lack of piston balancing, then?  Whether that, in and of itself, was a major point of concern, is irrelevant.  What learning about that and the way that the tech handed it did, in my mind, was to bring into question the entire build, which as of this point, you are also doing, Howie.

I guess I agree with Chip.  You wouldn't let Ken ride back to Clinton from Hot Springs with a tire you thought was too worn.  Why would you take off on a 2,000 mile road trip on a bike that you have that list of concerns with?

[ultrafxr]

Howie, i admire your determination.... .....i'm convinced you'll get it right.

i hate to tell you but MOCO has there covert ops on you.
this is my latest conspiracy theory and i'm sticking to it.



Good luck

TN

You sure they aren't just taking notes on how to fix the 110s once and for all?  Howie is their beta tester.

[skreminegul07]

Todays Update:

Didn't really get to catch up on 5 pages of uread threads yet, so I don't know how rampant the rumors are here regarding this build. So I'll set the record straight and update ya'll now. But I'll continue crap for the continuing breaking down of this engine, even though ya'll really know I'm doing everything humanly possible to make this POS 110 the best it can be and be totally reliable, in spite of HD's inability of doing same.

Now the latest on the engine. It's running fine. But there apparently was an issue with the attitude of the HD tech that built it again. I found out from 2 of the vendors I was dealing with, that he had major attitude issues with both of them when he found out he'd have to do more than just reassembling the engine. He wanted to treat it as "bolt-on HD parts build", as opposed to a custom engine build. Bitching about all the clearancing required, necessary adjustments, etc. There's no place for a bad attitude when assembling a custom motor. So that lack of proper attention led to a problem that surfaced by Fri, with less than 200 miles on it, and the engine never taken over 3000 RPM.

Hopefully this is the only issue he caused by his rushing to finish this before his vacation. A noise appeared and I traced it to a leaking rear cyl. head gasket. With the parts we used, this is only possible by not assembling it properly and rushing the reassembly. It is leaking alongside of the rear head, on the spark plug side. When cold, it makes a "chirping" noise, and you feel the compression leaking when placing your hand alongside the gasket area there. The rings are doing their job and holding any oil back from leaking, but the air leak is very apparent. This occurs when cold and is getting a little worse after each ride. It seals up after getting heated up, after all the metal expands to operating temp. The bike is running hotter too, and I believe that's because it's probably a little leaner due to the air leak. Oilt temp's gotten as high as 246 deg now.

When I first found this issue, I was furious when I heard about his lack of concern when assembling it, especially when he was "supposedly" taking great care in the reassembly. I only found out about this "attitude problem" after I called both vendors on Fri. He was already gone by then. I immediately made the decision to pull the motor, and have it completely rebuilt by a professional engine builder, like Wes, or replace it completely with aftermarket engine. I was leaning toward rebuilding it, including full Timkin conversion and replacement crank assembly, due to CVO originality, matching numbers, and the amount of $$ already put into the top end. Q offered to drop the motor off in Tampa next weekend, on his way to Daytona.

Well, after riding it all weekend, with the bike still running excellent, I decided right now, to first try snugging the headbolts to make the trip to MV. That is, if I cant get the gasket replaced by tomorrow, which is doubtful. If I can stop the leak by re torquing the head temporarily, I'll take my chances on the 2000 mile trip. I'll replace the rear gasket when I return. I'll probably have my friend's aftermarket shop do all the work from now on. What the hell was I thinking letting a dealer do this work. I had good comfort level after "taking care of him NYC style ", and due to the way I was being taken care of. I was confident he was doing the right thing, only to find he reverted to typical HD tech lack of caring while I wasn't there to "supervise".

After making the repair, I'll still be real nervous about how this motor was reassembled. But since it's running so well now, I see no reason to yank the engine yet. I can always do that if things take a turn for the worst. We do not want to cancel yet another trip with the bike, as it's been such a major disappointment all year. But I'm still plugging away with my usual zealousness, with my goal of making this bike the absolute perfect SERK. I'm still confident that it can be done, and will apply my same "pit bull" approach in getting it there. Hoist don't give up that easy. The thick skin might be wearing a little, but this rhinoceros can't be dissuaded that easily. I will persevere in this mission, and Cybil will rise from the ashes again, and live to ride many useful years under my ass!!!

More to follow on this continuing saga. Ya'll didn't really want it to end anyway. You'll miss all the entertainment value this thread has been providing over the past few months. And after all, this thread is only 19 pages long!!!

Hoist!

If this get worse?  Are you the eternal optimist?  You've had your share of dissapointment.  As others have posted, 2000 miles is a long trip with a BSR and a so far unreliable ride.  Wouldn't it make more sense to (gasp) trailer down to MV and ride when you arrive?  Someitimes it is the destination.  You could get hurt or at the least damage the parts you bought already.

You are welcome to borrow my trailer if you need one.

Good luck and keep focused.

phil

[Hoist!]

I appreciate that Phil. But I've we're probably not going now. I'll know a little more tomorrow, but it appears that Neal's was the last journey this engine will ever see. I'm still testing and will be bringing it back to the dealer and try to get a new motor right now. I've found some things wrong and will address it with the SM in person. Can't say much more now. That's my focus and cannot really think about trips until I have the reliable bike I've been looking for.

Hoist!

[skreminegul07]

I appreciate that Phil. But I've we're probably not going now. I'll know a little more tomorrow, but it appears that Neal's was the last journey this engine will ever see. I'm still testing and will be bringing it back to the dealer and try to get a new motor right now. I've found some things wrong and will address it with the SM in person. Can't say much more now. That's my focus and cannot really think about trips until I have the reliable bike I've been looking for.

Hoist!

Sounds like te best route.  Please keep us in the loop.

Howie, did you see the ugly spark plug I removed today from the rear cylinder?  Posted under Twin Cam.

Keep us in the loop. 

[TN]

You sure they aren't just taking notes on how to fix the 110s once and for all?  Howie is their beta tester.

10/4, it ashamed but someone has to. we all are beta testers....

 find someone to sponsor this thing.....


TN

[Twolanerider]

Howie,

Before it gets washed away in all the other details of the engine issues themselves you ought to share about the level of "assistance" in the "roadside assistance" you were given from the company we all know and love when you had the flat this time.

[The Mysterious Q!]

Don thanks to HOG roadside assistance I at least go to put on some miles. I rode 80 miles to pick up the new rubber.Their 1 a year policy for a tow is ridiculous. Later,Q 

[ultrafxr]

Howie,

Before it gets washed away in all the other details of the engine issues themselves you ought to share about the level of "assistance" in the "roadside assistance" you were given from the company we all know and love when you had the flat this time.

Don, from reports I've heard it is entirely the "luck of the draw."  By that I mean it just depends on where your breakdown occurs.  Several folks I know have had sterling experiences with Road America and the crews that were dispatched.  Others, like myself, have been left high and dry because there was not qualified contracted tow company anywhere near where we were stranded.  Can't understand in major metro areas like the northeast how that could be a problem but evidently it was for Howie.

[Hoist!]

Here you go gang. Make sure you guys check this out and uderstand it. HD's program is a SCAM!!! Designed to nickle and dime us for more $$$. Like they didn't make enough even though you can't use the bike on vacation!

http://www.cvoharley.com/smf/index.php?topic=17181.0

Hoist!

[Hoist!]

TODAY'S UPDATE:

Well I've made some decisions regarding this build. I just ordered a new set of HD 110" engine cases and will be building a new engine for this bike, with nothing HD in it but the cases themselves. They'll be sent out for a Timkin Conversion. New S&S Flywheels and Rods. It will be set for 0.000" runout and have no more than 0.0005" runout before it will be assembled. I'll be converting it to gear drive cams, possibly with the R&R Camplate. I'll probably be using all the parts from my new top end, with Wes making the same cam profile from Andrews blanks so the build stays the same. I was extremely happy with the way the bike rode. I'm not looking over my shoulder for the next HD part to break and strand me, or worse, kill me on my bike. I'm building a REAL motor now, so I can get on my bike, anytime, push the button, and go when and where I want! We might make some adjustments or changes, but nothing drastic from what I have now.

The engine will be built by Vern of North Shore Motorcycles in New Hyde Park, NY (Long Island). Vern's been building HD engines for over 25 years. He's got his own machine shop and can do everything but the Timkin Conversion, which will be done elsewhere to Vern's satisfaction. I have 5 months now to get this right. No corners will be cut. It will only get done right, and all the best parts will be in there, including the bottom end now too. I'm tired of waiting for the next thing to break. This is the only way I can rest assured that I have a shot at this thing being reliable. Won't be too much more than I've already spent. I've got so much tied up in this already, to get my perfect bike, that this needs to be done for me to be comfortable. I'm not playing games with HD's junk anymore. This whole engine needs to be bulletproof. And soon it will be!

Hoist!